Zteam Update, yes we are still alive! [28.8k warning]

[ShadowSpartan]

Hey everyone, it’s been a while since Zteam gave an update of our progress. As ChokingVictim said in another topic, the single player part of the mod hasn’t been touched in a while but that is due to us working on stuff to improve the mod, mainly programs. This brings me to a big announcement about the Zteam mod.

ChokingVictim and myself have been researching bitmaps.map and sounds.map, which we managed to map out in less than a day. After that I began to work on some code to allow for us to compile our own bitmaps.map and sounds.map. I added the code into Orion, Zteam’s program that can open any Halo map type and extract various items from them. Orion was programmed by myself, with ChokingVictim and CtrlAltDestroy helping with the research. It includes almost every program that has been created for the Zteam mod.

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-20-08/orion1.png

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-20-08/orion2.png

Going back to the bitmaps.map and sounds.map compilation. Whenever we release our campaign mod, we will also release a bitmaps.map and sounds.map that will be required to play the maps. This will decrease the file sizes of the map files drastically as well as still allow the stock maps to run. All you will need to do is replace your current bitmaps.map and sounds.map, and every map file will still work correctly.

To demonstrate the power of bitmap/sound cache compilation, take a multiplayer map of ours for example, Foundation:
Internal bitmaps/sounds: 112mb
External bitmaps/sounds: 28mb

Note: Post will be updated shortly, CAD is writing up his part as we speak

[CtrlAltDestroy]

Of course, we do not want to limit ourselves to just Halo: Custom Edition. Because of this, Zteam has expanded its frontiers, namely to Halo 2 for the Xbox and Vista. We have already made progress within this area; some minor, and some borderlining breakthrough. At the top of the list is animation extraction/injection. Spearheaded by the research done by Choking Victim and programming done by myself, animation extraction was completed in a matter of two or so months.

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-20-08/elite.gif
rawr

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-20-08/smg.gif
dedicated to: masterz (it's a real anim that shipped with h2, btw)

And the tool itself:
http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-20-08/animation_extractor.gif
to be released: when pigs fly


With extraction complete, injection was (relatively) easy to complete. Animation injection was done in around a week and a half with programming done by myself.

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-05-08/br_rel_new_render.gif
the animation itself

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-20-08/animation_raw_generator.jpg
generates the raw data from an animation created in 3ds max

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-20-08/raw_injector.jpg
injects the raw into a halo 2 xbox map

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/06-05-08/br_rel_new.gif
the injected animation, in halo 2 xbox

Because animation raw is practically identical between halo 2 vista and halo 2 xbox, generating h2v animation tags isn't too far down the road.



** More updates to be coming shortly...

[n00b1n8R]

What's the point of posting the tools if your never going to release it?

[ShadowSpartan]

What's the point of posting the tools if your never going to release it?
To show you what we have been up to, and what we are capable of doing now as a result of these tools being created.

[CtrlAltDestroy]

To be fair, I was poking fun at how "exclusive" and closed-source the halo community is, however hypocritical that may seem. Documentation/tools on halo 2 animation injection will be released down the line, but to be honest, the extraction utilities we have will most likely stay with us. As for bitmap/sound compilation tools, we'll see...

[Hotrod]

Well, I'm glad to see that this is coming along well, it looks very promising. Does this mean that you'll be able to take all the animations from Halo 2, and put them into Halo CE?

[Zeph]

Lol, closed source exclusivity continued. Sucky H2V will stay the same.

[Anton]

I love the h2x extraction/injection btw. I'm REALLY looking forward to that. Keep up the work guys.

[Rosco]

Reminds me of the AK reload on CoD, because of the way he throws the mag away.

Of course other games do that, but CoD's been an addiction lately :p

[supersniper]

Crap by keeping it exclusive you not helping the community.
But it looks fantastic.

[StankBacon]

but to be honest, the extraction utilities we have will most likely stay with us.

why?

i really don't see a reason to keep anything, no matter how breakthrough, to yourselves... i mean what the fuck....

[Limited]

Nice, how the hell did you work out map magic for a custom map? :O

Very good work, right now it doesnt matter it wont get released because you will use these to make better maps, so it does help the comminuty.

[CtrlAltDestroy]

Jesus fucking christ.

I'm sorry, do we owe the community something? Since when do we have any sort of obligation for ingrates such as yourself?

1. Our actions need no justification.
2. The extraction tools won't be released anyways. Drop it.

[n00b1n8R]

Do you owe the community something? No, but what do you gain by not releasing it?

By releasing it, the community gains a great tool and h2v might become a little less of a failure game. + you get the community's gratification if that counts for anything.

[CtrlAltDestroy]

I'm not sure how the extractor would help h2v, as it only works on the xbox version. Making it work with h2v would be redundant really. Besides, we are already planning on releasing the injector which is what would benefit h2v if anything.

[Choking Victim]

What do you gain from animation extraction? Nothing. What do you gain from animation injection? A customizable h2v and h2x beyond your expectations. I don't see what the problem is. I've never seen the community happy about anything we've offered, like a child that always wants more.

[kid908]

looks really neat =P

i also see no use for animation export...unless you're making a really good render movie of halo. or you're ripping to put in other games but don't want to redo the animations yourself.

@CAD:
is the smg flicking animation really was shipped with h2?

=) i would like to see the ratio of the sound/bitmap external size to original. is it get really big or increase by a few kb/mb?

[CtrlAltDestroy]

To demonstrate the power of bitmap/sound cache compilation, take a multiplayer map of ours for example, Foundation:
Internal bitmaps/sounds: 112mb
External bitmaps/sounds: 28mb

And yes, that animation did ship with Halo 2.

[Choking Victim]

is the smg flicking animation really was shipped with h2?

It's actually the smg sprinting animation, if you recall, h2 had sprinting capabilities at some point during production (which was obviously cut). I guess the animation was made towards the end of that feature as a joke.

[CtrlAltDestroy]

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/03-23-08/br_sprint.gif

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/03-24-08/smg_lulz.gif

If you want a look at the sprinting animations.

[kid908]

And yes, that animation did ship with Halo 2.


i mean the actual bitmap and sound map size. not the scenario map.

also the flicking animation don't even look like a sprint animation. more like a dearm animation to me...

[CtrlAltDestroy]

By spriting animation, we mean that the animation was in the sprint animation slot of the tag/meta.

[Choking Victim]

i mean the actual bitmap and sound map size. not the scenario map.

also the flicking animation don't even look like a sprint animation. more like a dearm animation to me...
well, the animation is called "first_person:dual:sprint:var0" so...I think its safe to assume it was a joke sprinting anim. :rolleyes:

[Kornman00]

Jesus fucking christ.

I'm sorry, do we owe the community something? Since when do we have any sort of obligation for ingrates such as yourself?

1. Our actions need no justification.
2. The extraction tools won't be released anyways. Drop it.
It's not really nice to show off the tools then be like "oh, btw, no soup for you! lololololololol". I really don't see the point in showing off something to the community when you'll never release it. You only have yourself to blame for gripes and complaints when you do that.

[supersniper]

^ Agreed. Yes you are the ones that made it but think about it. This community is starting to increase in more better map makers and by you guys releasing your utilities you can increase that percentage. More maps of quality will be made and therefore the game itself would have more players because of the maps made. But by keeping them to yourselves to me it seems your just selfish and don't want to share all the greats stuff you guys made.

[Pyong Kawaguchi]

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/03-23-08/br_sprint.gif

http://www.halotrialmods.org/zteam/images/03-24-08/smg_lulz.gif

If you want a look at the sprinting animations.
win, I can has links to the pictures?

[Reaper Man]

Oh damn, why'd they have to cut the sprinting? I've always found movement on foot in H2 painfully slow. Does the finger sprinting animation have corresponding third person animations? :-3

[memyselfandI]

Jesus fucking christ.

I'm sorry, do we owe the community something? Since when do we have any sort of obligation for ingrates such as yourself?

1. Our actions need no justification.
2. The extraction tools won't be released anyways. Drop it.

Well obviously some people think they are god and never utilized ANY source code, or got advice or help from ANYONE for anything...and you also managed to reverse engineer absolutely everything about halo/halo2 yourself, without the assistance of anyone or any other apps. COUGH ASSHOLE COUGH BULLSHIT. Thing is, you wouldnt have know 3/4 of what you know now, if it wasnt for others releasing what they found out. It would literally take you decades to get all the information by yourself, to understand ANY mapfile enuff to do what we can do now, AS A COMMUNITY.

Am I a "fucking ingrate'? No. You are. Obviously you intend on keeping a 'holier than thou' attitude, and think you are absolutley king SHIT on TURD Island. You are a joke. Sure u might be able to program, but a few classes and most others can too. You have no sense of decency, charisma, clarity is way beyond your compreshension, I could go on and on.

You sir, fail completely to open your eyes and look beyond your own screen and realize what all the oldtimers AND newcomers have made possible for YOU to understand about modding. You are a complete fucking loser, in terms of modding. Newcomers join and leave everyday, when they see posts with attitudes like yours. Halomods.com is just one example. They have an admins over there that comepletely enjoy making newbies look stooopid for the simple enjoyment of it. Hence Halomods.com traffic is 1/10th what it used to be. They fail to realize that everyone was a noobie at one point. Whether modders are 12 or 50 years old, they don't enjoy being made to look bad, or feel bad, or see others with "Na Na Na I Made It And You Can't Have It!" attitudes.

I have learned something new about the mapfiles from each and every single source code ever posted. Plain and simple truth.

I hope you enjoy pushing old and new members out of the community. Congrats to you and your 'team", as you call it.

[Choking Victim]

When someone takes something like this as serious as you have (memyselfandI), then calls CAD a loser, it really just reflects how lame you really are. CAD's always said to me "it all boils down to just pixels on a screen" a concept you need to grasp before you begin guarding a simple game with your "life". Congrats on your "life" as you call it, apparently we've struck a nerve.

EDIT: Also, about us gaining research from other people, show me one place that has research on halo 2 animations. Despite what you know, alot of the info on model, sound, and bitmap extraction is flawed. Flaws we've fixed with our own research of aspects people overlooked. I doubt it would have taken us years to research it all ourselves, seeing as we were pretty much blindly researching animations without prior research to guide us, and that only took two months.

[memyselfandI]

Obviously u didnt read my post, or cannot comprehend what true/total reverse engineering is. I will not comment anymore on your failure for understanding what I posted. Others will know. Hell, even some noobies will be able to see and understand what I mean. You sir, apparently are wearing rose colored glasses, and are blinded by your app's abilities.

Theres no doubt halo model injection was flawed, but how would you even have known where to look without it? Any dumbass (as you have proven) would also know to look where the model lies for animations information.

Handicaps such as yours are the ones that I am truly afraid of in this world.

[Choking Victim]

Don't worry about it, I read your post. My answer was sufficient, I wont be downgraded to name calling.

[CtrlAltDestroy]

While I acknowledge and respect the points you have made, I'll have to ask you to keep your argument out of this thread and between me through PMs or instant messaging, if you wish to continue it.

As for the animation extractor, our decision stands. Stop posting about it.

[il Duce Primo]

If it has helped you it will most likely help others. Why not help others when you can? Keeping to yourself is plain and simple, selfish.

[Flyboy]

Though I agree that all this should go public may I say agree to what CAD says if you don't want this to turn into another CMT blackout. <_<

[sdavis117]

Zteam made it, so they should say if it is released or not. If they say they don't want to release it, then they shouldn't have to release it.

[JunkfoodMan]

Doesn't mean we can't convince them to release it :downs:

[ShadowSpartan]

Doesn't mean we can't convince them to release it :downs:
Or more like annoy us to the point where we don't release anything at all, don't push your luck.

[Amit]

It's not really nice to show off the tools then be like "oh, btw, no soup for you! lololololololol". I really don't see the point in showing off something to the community when you'll never release it. You only have yourself to blame for gripes and complaints when you do that.

Well gripes go up, not down right? :D


Well obviously some people think they are god and never utilized ANY source code, or got advice or help from ANYONE for anything...and you also managed to reverse engineer absolutely everything about halo/halo2 yourself, without the assistance of anyone or any other apps. COUGH ASSHOLE COUGH BULLSHIT. Thing is, you wouldnt have know 3/4 of what you know now, if it wasnt for others releasing what they found out. It would literally take you decades to get all the information by yourself, to understand ANY mapfile enuff to do what we can do now, AS A COMMUNITY.

Am I a "fucking ingrate'? No. You are. Obviously you intend on keeping a 'holier than thou' attitude, and think you are absolutley king SHIT on TURD Island. You are a joke. Sure u might be able to program, but a few classes and most others can too. You have no sense of decency, charisma, clarity is way beyond your compreshension, I could go on and on.

You sir, fail completely to open your eyes and look beyond your own screen and realize what all the oldtimers AND newcomers have made possible for YOU to understand about modding. You are a complete fucking loser, in terms of modding. Newcomers join and leave everyday, when they see posts with attitudes like yours. Halomods.com is just one example. They have an admins over there that comepletely enjoy making newbies look stooopid for the simple enjoyment of it. Hence Halomods.com traffic is 1/10th what it used to be. They fail to realize that everyone was a noobie at one point. Whether modders are 12 or 50 years old, they don't enjoy being made to look bad, or feel bad, or see others with "Na Na Na I Made It And You Can't Have It!" attitudes.

I have learned something new about the mapfiles from each and every single source code ever posted. Plain and simple truth.

I hope you enjoy pushing old and new members out of the community. Congrats to you and your 'team", as you call it.

Um...do you realize they are just some of the very few that started all this? The body and brain of each member of the ZTeam are a very intelligent team. Now, multiply that by three and you get an awesome team.


Obviously u didnt read my post, or cannot comprehend what true/total reverse engineering is. I will not comment anymore on your failure for understanding what I posted. Others will know. Hell, even some noobies will be able to see and understand what I mean. You sir, apparently are wearing rose colored glasses, and are blinded by your app's abilities.

Theres no doubt halo model injection was flawed, but how would you even have known where to look without it? Any dumbass (as you have proven) would also know to look where the model lies for animations information.

Handicaps such as yours are the ones that I am truly afraid of in this world.

Umm...have you been lurking around the Halo community for the past 5 years? Or are you some long time member who is trying to trap someone naive to fall into your flame trap? DUDE! Who the hell are you?

Seriously people, it shows as a bitch move but there is something you guys are forgetting. In nature, it's a world where you do what you want. It's dog-eat-dog. If you kill someone, well there you go. It's not right but you just did it. Someone else will just come along and do it to you if they desire to.

What I'm getting at is that they can show what they want and not release it. There is no law saying they must. And back to nature now; if you guys want the tools so badly and can't have them, you have a few choices:

1. Annoy the shit out of them till they release it or, the more likely, destroy it.
2. Persuade the admins of all halo related websites and communities to IP ban them on identification.
3. Go find them in real life and take the tools for yourself. Torture and kill them if you find it feasible.

4. Or you can be practical and accept it.

I dislike their decision but you must still respect it.

[kenney001]

Do you people not read?

Animation injection: The one thing that we actually need, they said they might release later on down the road. This is the one program that the community would improve with, and I think great custom content can come from this.

Animation extraction: Releasing this would be death to all custom content. It would allow people just to rip their animations instead of create their own, and probably violate a few EULA rules. Its fine if Zteam makes this themselves for the learning, uses it to create one single awesome h2 clone that would be damn-near impossible to recreate, and keeps it to themselves, but it is not something I want spread into the public. That would be a disaster. Remember what happened with HEK+? A horrid avalanche of identical ripped animations to ensue.

Looks nice guys, keep it up.

[wanger]

Or more like annoy us to the point where we don't release anything at all, don't push your luck.

^^Limed for truth.

[Masterz1337]

Do you people not read?

Animation injection: The one thing that we actually need, they said they might release later on down the road. This is the one program that the community would improve with, and I think great custom content can come from this.

Animation extraction: Releasing this would be death to all custom content. It would allow people just to rip their animations instead of create their own, and probably violate a few EULA rules. Its fine if Zteam makes this themselves for the learning, uses it to create one single awesome h2 clone that would be damn-near impossible to recreate, and keeps it to themselves, but it is not something I want spread into the public. That would be a disaster. Remember what happened with HEK+? A horrid avalanche of identical ripped animations to ensue.

Looks nice guys, keep it up.
He speaks the truth.

[Anton]

I will be happy with H2x Animation Injections.. It will please me just to know how you do it. I only know one other person who's currently active in h2x modding that has the knowledge to do this besides you guys. He's not even worried about working on it, because he thinks it's pointless because h2x is dying. The reason people wanted the extraction tools is for Halo 2 Rendering in Max/Maya/Others..

Also, guy's please ignore all these useless posts, and realize there are a select few who REALLY need these tools. :[ It would set the modding world free of annoying stock jmads.

Keep up the work guys, you guys are great no matter what choice you make.

[Amit]

Do you people not read?

Animation injection: The one thing that we actually need, they said they might release later on down the road. This is the one program that the community would improve with, and I think great custom content can come from this.

Animation extraction: Releasing this would be death to all custom content. It would allow people just to rip their animations instead of create their own, and probably violate a few EULA rules. Its fine if Zteam makes this themselves for the learning, uses it to create one single awesome h2 clone that would be damn-near impossible to recreate, and keeps it to themselves, but it is not something I want spread into the public. That would be a disaster. Remember what happened with HEK+? A horrid avalanche of identical ripped animations to ensue.

Looks nice guys, keep it up.

Exactly! The only thing you can do with extraction is what you've stated above and what's the point then? Just to show that you can rip anything from any map? Get real people.

Be grateful that you even get injection!

[Syuusuke]

In the words of the philosopher Mick Jagger,

"You can't always get what you want."

[DrunkenSamus]

In the words of the philosopher Mick Jagger,

"You can't always get what you want."

That is so cliche.:rolleyes:

[StankBacon]

It's not really nice to show off the tools then be like "oh, btw, no soup for you! lololololololol". I really don't see the point in showing off something to the community when you'll never release it. You only have yourself to blame for gripes and complaints when you do that.

winrar.

[ShadowSpartan]

winrar.
So according to your logic, Kornman is allowed to show off tools and not release to the public, yet we aren't allowed to? He has shown off plenty of content and most of it has not been released to the public.
(http://halo.modacity.net/forums/showthread.php?t=4355)

[Limited]

I dunno if Kornman was joking or not, hopefully he was, considering hes done this but like 10x as much :D Still <3 though.

memyselfandI? Are you JAY or some thing? Seriously, are you just babbling about any thing? Your last post skipped past everything you said and just uttered the words "ya every1 can do it". Right...

Would you all have been happier if they hadnt even mentioned these tools, and just showed the animations? Probably yes...hence why alot of things arent common knowledge in this comminuty, we all keep secrets right...

[Kornman00]

So according to your logic, Kornman is allowed to show off tools and not release to the public, yet we aren't allowed to? He has shown off plenty of content and most of it has not been released to the public.
(http://halo.modacity.net/forums/showthread.php?t=4355)
I was working on most of those tools with Ghost. Then he went and got himself a female to fornicate, leaving me to develop by myself. Some of that stuff in the thread I don't even have the source to and thus can't work on.

Difference is, I never said I would never release any of that to the public. I just haven't yet. There are many days in the year, but only one of me.

[Limited]

Talking about slow projects korn, hows prometheus?

[nooBBooze]

That is so commonplace
Fix'd

[TVTyrant]

:( I don't even know what animation extractors and injectors are. Or why you would or wouldn't release them. Plz help teh nub :'(

EDIT:And, on an even more noobish note...When are the new maps going to be available? :D

[n00b1n8R]

Do you people not read?

Animation injection: The one thing that we actually need, they said they might release later on down the road. This is the one program that the community would improve with, and I think great custom content can come from this.

Animation extraction: Releasing this would be death to all custom content. It would allow people just to rip their animations instead of create their own, and probably violate a few EULA rules. Its fine if Zteam makes this themselves for the learning, uses it to create one single awesome h2 clone that would be damn-near impossible to recreate, and keeps it to themselves, but it is not something I want spread into the public. That would be a disaster. Remember what happened with HEK+? A horrid avalanche of identical ripped animations to ensue.

Looks nice guys, keep it up.
At the risk of sounding like the worst of heretics, so fucking what?

Everyone always bitches about ripped content or ripped maps or any other ripped anything but nobody fucking cares. You act as though these people are making you download these maps and forcing you to play them, which they are not. If you don't like it, don't download it, don't play it but leave it at that. You have no right to tell other people what they can and cannot do. You have no right to tell people what they can and cannot enjoy. You are no better than anybody else.

People can look at these ripped anims and learn from them, or re-use them in their maps. You say that these animations are poor quality? Their the same ones as in halo 2 and I personally never had any issues with them. If somebody makes a custom gun and wants to use these anims (or an altered version) as opposed making their own which may not be as good, then that's their choice and good for them. The only result of this that I can see is more decent looking anims which I'm sure nobody will say is a bad thing.

Further more, there are people enjoy making maps, using custom weapons and doing all that stuff. They find it fun. If you're not in this community to let other people have fun (even if that's not your main reason) than I find it hard to understand why you're here at all.

Halo is a game, and you people take it so seriously it's ridiculous. Close sourcing anything is probably the worst thing anybody could do for the community.


win, I can has links to the pictures?
Just right click them and go "view image".


:( I don't even know what animation extractors and injectors are. Or why you would or wouldn't release them. Plz help teh nub :'( Animation extractors take animations out of the game and put them into max or maya or w/e. Animation injectors put custom animations back into games. Can't explain it any simpler than that.

[TVTyrant]

Thank you for explaining it to a noob like me. Twas quite civil of thee.

[Kornman00]

Talking about slow projects korn, hows prometheus?
lol, I haven't been on the prom team since dec 2005

[Masterz1337]

People can look at these ripped anims and learn from them, or re-use them in their maps. You say that these animations are poor quality? Their the same ones as in halo 2 and I personally never had any issues with them. If somebody makes a custom gun and wants to use these anims (or an altered version) as opposed making their own which may not be as good, then that's their choice and good for them. The only result of this that I can see is more decent looking anims which I'm sure nobody will say is a bad thing.

Further more, there are people enjoy making maps, using custom weapons and doing all that stuff. They find it fun. If you're not in this community to let other people have fun (even if that's not your main reason) than I find it hard to understand why you're here at all.

Halo is a game, and you people take it so seriously it's ridiculous. Close sourcing anything is probably the worst thing anybody could do for the community.


Just right click them and go "view image".

Animation extractors take animations out of the game and put them into max or maya or w/e. Animation injectors put custom animations back into games. Can't explain it any simpler than that.

Regardless of open or closed source, these arn't even Zteams animations they would be releasing. They are Bungies, and no one other than them should be releasing their content.

People go bananas when their own content is ripped, but they are always complaining when H2 or H3 content is held back from being open sourced.

[Limited]

lol, I haven't been on the prom team since dec 2005Damn, you spoke to nick lately though? They might as well just call it off and we will drop out hopes.

Like masters and the person whoever said it before, extraction of animations wont really help, okay people could learn from them/edit them, but then we will just see a million rubbish animation sets that are basically bungies but tweeked ever so little.

[Choking Victim]

You have no right to tell other people what they can and cannot do. You have no right to tell people what they can and cannot enjoy. You are no better than anybody else.
So stop telling us to release. You're no better than everyone else, you can't tell us what we can and cannot do. :rolleyes:

[TVTyrant]

Lol. Didn't sir CAD say not to discuss this in the thread? We're gonna get locked guys...

Again, is there a time table for release of Z_Zanzibar?

[n00b1n8R]

So stop telling us to release. You're no better than everyone else, you can't tell us what we can and cannot do. :rolleyes:
That part was directed at all the people bitching about ripped content in maps, not at Z team specifically.

I was only giving my opinion on the matter about the release.

[ShadowSpartan]

I was working on most of those tools with Ghost. Then he went and got himself a female to fornicate, leaving me to develop by myself. Some of that stuff in the thread I don't even have the source to and thus can't work on.

Difference is, I never said I would never release any of that to the public. I just haven't yet. There are many days in the year, but only one of me.
I never said that certain features that Orion has will never be released. With the way the community throws a fit about the littlest thing though, it makes me not want to release anything at all later on down the road.

I'm all for giving back to the community, but releasing apps like the animation extractor will not be as great as a benefit as everyone thinks it will.


Again, is there a time table for release of Z_Zanzibar?
About time someone caught that :p. We don't have a set time on a release for pb3.

[supersniper]

... Zanzibar, I thought you were doing Terminal?

[Masterz1337]

Now he's going to post that gif again >_>.

[supersniper]

:D. I just wanted to see it again.

[TVTyrant]

Indeed. Plz post it. I haven't seen it yet...Wow I sound like a nub XD

[ShadowSpartan]

... Zanzibar, I thought you were doing Terminal?
We were working on terminal before. We have quite a few maps that are in the process of being converted.

As for the gif, I can't find a copy of it, but once I get my hands on it I will post it just for Masterz :p.

[Ki11a_FTW]

haha i remember that gif from halomods

[TVTyrant]

This makes me feel left out. I DON'T WANT DESSERT!!

[Ki11a_FTW]

Just searched through the old topic at halomods, image is dead :Sadface:

[ICEE]

This is all well and good, but if your not going to allow anyone to use the apps why show them off? And If the content is so sacred that you can't release it to the public, then you shouldn't rip it at all.

[ShadowSpartan]

This is all well and good, but if your not going to allow anyone to use the apps why show them off? And If the content is so sacred that you can't release it to the public, then you shouldn't rip it at all.
I've said why we showed them off already, go back and actually read the topic. We never said the content was so "sacred" that we can't release to the public. We plan on releasing the content in the mod, just not the tools that extracted the content.

[Bodzilla]

Where would you guys be if kornman and bitterbanana and all the others kept these things to themselves in ce?

You'd be still in the fuckign stoneage and all the things that have prolonged the life of the game and improvements and breakthrough's wouldn't exist.

Swallow your ego and Become the asset to the community you think you are.

[TVTyrant]

I can see why they don't want to release it...As soon as I found out what this was, I had this image of myself ripping the living shit out of H2V and releasing a bunch of maps. So, because of nubs like myself, its probably better that they aren't released.

On the contrary, some of my favorite H2 maps still haven't been made in CE. Midship, Containment, Burial Mounds, Lockout, a good Zanzibar...etc. It would be nice if someone made them, and these apps would give people the ability to do so efficiently.

[kenney001]

Its one thing to release the ripped content, but its a totally different ballgame to release the capabilities to do so.....

[Heathen]

Dammit...If they wanna keep it then fuck it.
They could have not told us jack and left us wondering "I wonder what the ZTeam is up to?" and then not told us how they magically did all this.
But they didn't.
Be happy :/

[Rosco]

I think sprinting should be kept, because it always baffles me that a guy trained to be super fast can only jog with weapons the size of his hands and wrists. :P

[memyselfandI]

Do you people not read?

Animation injection: The one thing that we actually need, they said they might release later on down the road. This is the one program that the community would improve with, and I think great custom content can come from this.

Animation extraction: Releasing this would be death to all custom content. It would allow people just to rip their animations instead of create their own, and probably violate a few EULA rules. Its fine if Zteam makes this themselves for the learning, uses it to create one single awesome h2 clone that would be damn-near impossible to recreate, and keeps it to themselves, but it is not something I want spread into the public. That would be a disaster. Remember what happened with HEK+? A horrid avalanche of identical ripped animations to ensue.

Looks nice guys, keep it up.

ROFL @ teh noob...and @ Z-team for being the original noobasaurus.

99% of released mods are ripped content.....alll we do is slighty edit and modify bungies content. Whether its placements, or models, and how they get used. Grow the fuck up. Everything else can be extracted, and we learn from the stock meta numbers, etc. By not releasing the extractors, you simply make it harder on everyone to figure out proper animation meta.

Way to bring the community down, z-team. The community has given you EVERYTHIGN, and you, in return, do nothing, except write a crappy cmd app. FAILZORZ.

Handicaps such as YOURS are the one that truly scare me in this world.
z-team fail rate thus far = %100

[PenGuin1362]

^ Do me a favor and never ever open your mouth again. That was the dumbest comment I've ever read in my life. First off, 99% of those mods, suck fucking ass because no one knows how to make their own fucking shit. Second, if people learned from ripping why the hell does everyone still suck so much at modding? No one has done shit for z-team, they have done everything for themselves, they did the research, they did the coding. No one needs any damn extraction tools. Learn to do things on your own. And with that I would like to say, get the fuck out.


Where would you guys be if kornman and bitterbanana and all the others kept these things to themselves in ce?

You'd be still in the fuckign stoneage and all the things that have prolonged the life of the game and improvements and breakthrough's wouldn't exist.

Swallow your ego and Become the asset to the community you think you are.

I think that was a little uncalled for >_>. They said they will release everything except extraction. I see no reason for anyone to have the extraction tools anyway >_>. Last time someone released extraction tools everyone bitched and moaned when someone used them.

Please note:

Documentation/tools on halo 2 animation injection will be released down the line, but to be honest, the extraction utilities we have will most likely stay with us. As for bitmap/sound compilation tools, we'll see...

Only one I don't really understand why is sound compilation >_>.

[Choking Victim]

ROFL @ teh noob...and @ Z-team for being the original noobasaurus.

99% of released mods are ripped content.....alll we do is slighty edit and modify bungies content. Whether its placements, or models, and how they get used. Grow the fuck up. Everything else can be extracted, and we learn from the stock meta numbers, etc. By not releasing the extractors, you simply make it harder on everyone to figure out proper animation meta.

Way to bring the community down, z-team. The community has given you EVERYTHIGN, and you, in return, do nothing, except write a crappy cmd app. FAILZORZ.

Handicaps such as YOURS are the one that truly scare me in this world.
z-team fail rate thus far = %100

I don't see how extracting raw animation data helps anyone see "proper animation meta". Please learn about what your talking about before posting. Be happy we're releasing animation injection, it was CAD's idea to look into it and supply the community with something at all. Originally we only had extraction in the works with no intention of a release. When we've wanted something, we took the time to look into it and eventually accomplished it (script extraction, external map compilation, animation extraction/injection, and the list goes on). You say any idiot can do what we've done...so get started.

idiot

[ShadowSpartan]

Only one I don't really understand why is sound compilation >_>.

He was talking about the bitmaps.map and sounds.map compilation. We don't want multiple map files floating around that people have to switch out in order to play our maps. These map files will be required to play our singleplayer and multiplayer maps once we release the final versions. Don't worry, stock maps will still work once you replace your bitmaps.map and sounds.map with ours.

[Gamerkd16]

1. Annoy the shit out of them till they release it or, the more likely, destroy it.
2. Persuade the admins of all halo related websites and communities to IP ban them on identification.
3. Go find them in real life and take the tools for yourself. Torture and kill them if you find it feasible.

4. Or you can be practical and accept it.

5. Wait for it to be leaked.

...because that usually happens at some point down the line.:eyesroll:

[ShadowSpartan]

5. Wait for it to be leaked.

...because that usually happens at some point down the line.:eyesroll:
There are only 3 of us on the team. I highly doubt one of us is going to leak.

[kenney001]

99% of released mods are ripped content.....alll we do is slighty edit and modify bungies content. Whether its placements, or models, and how they get used. Grow the fuck up. Everything else can be extracted, and we learn from the stock meta numbers, etc. By not releasing the extractors, you simply make it harder on everyone to figure out proper animation meta.have you seen the amount of shitty maps floating around with poorly ripped h2 weapons? Besides, the models and textures for them are readily available, and animations are the last sacred art...

This is what happens (http://hce.halomaps.org/index.cfm?search=lockout&B1=Search)
And this when bsp ripping was possible (http://hce.halomaps.org/index.cfm?search=gulch&B1=Search)


Way to bring the community down, z-team. The community has given you EVERYTHIGN, and you, in return, do nothing, except write a crappy cmd app. FAILZORZ.so they havent given us sanctuary (one of the most played and downloaded maps) or the actual campaign scripts to allow bsp modification and scenario rebuilding?


Handicaps such as YOURS are the one that truly scare me in this world.
z-team fail rate thus far = %100wow...
http://hce.halomaps.org/index.cfm?search=zteam&B1=Search
look at the download numbers....
then learn to do your own research

[Choking Victim]

There are only 3 of us on the team. I highly doubt one of us is going to leak.
Not to mention that our animation extraction maxscript and orion app is locked to our pc's. ;)

[Amit]

Indeed. Plz post it. I haven't seen it yet...Wow I sound like a nub XD


ROFL, that gif was epic. I had it somewhere but it may have been sucked into the black hole when I reformatted.


ROFL @ teh noob...and @ Z-team for being the original noobasaurus.

99% of released mods are ripped content.....alll we do is slighty edit and modify bungies content. Whether its placements, or models, and how they get used. Grow the fuck up. Everything else can be extracted, and we learn from the stock meta numbers, etc. By not releasing the extractors, you simply make it harder on everyone to figure out proper animation meta.

Way to bring the community down, z-team. The community has given you EVERYTHIGN, and you, in return, do nothing, except write a crappy cmd app. FAILZORZ.

Handicaps such as YOURS are the one that truly scare me in this world.
z-team fail rate thus far = %100

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h262/amit9821/6d84e831b875f6f.png


Do me a favour and show us what you've contributed to the community so far. Show us the EPIC modifications you've made to this game and shared knowledge you've lent to the community.

[p0lar_bear]

Wow, did I just walk into a preschool or what? Shall I call nap time, because everyone seems fussy.

-Zteam releases something. People are happy.
-Zteam stops releasing stuff for a little while. People wonder what's going on.
-People ask for an update.

If Zteam was vague about it and just said "yeah we're working on some apps to make our content extraction more accurate and useful," this would have happened:

-People ask for pics. Zteam posts them.
-People marvel at the pics of the extracted animations.
-People ask for pics of the tools. Zteam posts them.
-People marvel at the pics of the tools.
-People ask about the release of tools or research. Zteam says "no extractor, just injector."
-People throw a hissyfit because they're not getting everything.

This is what happened:

-Zteam posts pictures of extracted content and tools, and says that they're releasing no extractor, just the injector.
-People throw a hissyfit because they're not getting everything.

---

Zteam doesn't HAVE to release anything "for the good of the community." They made tools for themselves based off their research that are relevant to THEIR mod. Their tools aren't relevant to anyone else mods to be honest; everyone just wants them to be relevant. If you think that these tools are relevant to your work, then research Halo 2 map cache files and data tags yourself and make them yourself.

Now, pipe the fuck down before I start banning people. This drama is as old as the Halo community itself. Any more "TIEM TO SAEV TEH DAY FROM NAZI MODDER" posts or bickering because you're not getting everything they're making will be met with a smack to the face.

[p0lar_bear]

About the picture in question, is that the one where Masterz gets nailed by the train? :lol:

[ShadowSpartan]

About the picture in question, is that the one where Masterz gets nailed by the train? :lol:
Yeah it is :p. Nobody has a copy of it though :(.

[Kornman00]

About the picture in question, is that the one where Masterz gets nailed by the train? :lol:


Nobody has a copy of it though :(.
Quick, to the Batcave (http://www.archive.org/web/web.php)!

[DaneO'Roo]

^ holy shit

http://web.archive.org/web/20070115140322rn_2/www.h2vista.net/forums/main.php

[CtrlAltDestroy]

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/5702/masterzgotownedmu2.gif


ROFL @ teh noob...and @ Z-team for being the original noobasaurus.

99% of released mods are ripped content.....alll we do is slighty edit and modify bungies content. Whether its placements, or models, and how they get used. Grow the fuck up. Everything else can be extracted, and we learn from the stock meta numbers, etc. By not releasing the extractors, you simply make it harder on everyone to figure out proper animation meta.

Way to bring the community down, z-team. The community has given you EVERYTHIGN, and you, in return, do nothing, except write a crappy cmd app. FAILZORZ.

Handicaps such as YOURS are the one that truly scare me in this world.
z-team fail rate thus far = %100

If the halo 2 modding community is composed of other retards like yourself, then I would be more than happy to see your pathetic little community die. I'm sorry if I'm generalizing the entire community based on the impression you're giving, but frankly I'm starting to wonder if we should even release the information and research we worked hard on obtaining.

Also, grimdoomer, I can think of a number of reasons why a command-line application would be far superior in this case. First off, it increases productivity. Even though it may seem less user friendly to imbeciles such as yourself, the fact that it is command-line means it can be batch processed. The entire injection process can be simplified into one batch file, which would perform all of the necessary tasks in a matter of seconds. Second off it makes the debugging process far quicker for the aforementioned reason. Third off, in the unlikely event I would want to make a user-interface for the application, the process would be very simple in the way that there are already multiple GUI shells for the command-line utility Tool for Halo: Custom Edition. The fact that it is a command-line application does not make it any less useful or powerful than an application with a GUI. I could drone on and on about the advantages, but frankly it would be wasted on the likes of you.

Again, I'm sorry to those in the halo 2 modding community to whom the previously stated does not apply.

[ODX]

I was just about to post that :\
I had that page bookmarked, seen here (http://halo.modacity.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6842&page=52)...sorry Masters:

[Masterz1337]

Bastards.

[ShadowSpartan]

Bastards.
Oh come on, it never gets old watching you get splattered by the train. :p

[Ifafudafi]

Bah, everything awesome always happens when I'm gone.

The animation injection/extraction looks win, but I don't see why you don't plan to release the injector tools. Extraction I can understand simply to prevent the flood of H2 animations in HCE content, but injection would be a really neat thing if it could be modified to work with H2V, and might even pave the way for future tools. The community's always going to gripe about something, but you can have some bitching with a lot of praise for releasing tools, or a lot of bitching and no praise for keeping 'em to yourselves.

Orion should be incredibly handy, though, and releasing it would help anyone else making bitmap/sound heavy mods.

Still, I'd love to see some more progress on the actual Zteam mod, either campaign or multiplayer. Especially Zanzibar (which, next to Blood Gulch, is my favorite map in the Halo series.)

[CodeBrain]

Um... I really doubt that memyselfandI is grimdoomer. >_<

I can has proofs, pics?

Also, CAD, Answer my PM, its been sitting there for 2 days >_<

[ShadowSpartan]

The animation injection/extraction looks win, but I don't see why you don't plan to release the injector tools.
We do plan on releasing the injector tools...that is what the main part of the fight was about, us releasing the injector but not extractor.

[Inferno]

If i were to make a suggestion. Since your not going to release the extractor for the animations could you make a extractor that just extracted the origins so if i wanted to add a new idle animation or reload animation to the battle rifle i wouldn't have to re create the origins PERFECTLY so the animations fit together.

[Ifafudafi]

We do plan on releasing the injector tools...that is what the main part of the fight was about, us releasing the injector but not extractor.

Ah, apologies. Then you have no complaints here. The extractor would just end up being an excuse for nubs to be lazy.

[CodeBrain]

Im probably going to get -rep, but whatever...

DO NOT RELEASE THAT extraction tool for halo 2. That would ruin almost all the creativity of almost all the animators. They would just use stock halo 2 animations, and not push themselves and give enough effort to make them themselves.

[kenney001]

^^that was exactly my point

[supersniper]

What about Orion will that be release??

[demonmaster3k]

keep up the great work zteam dudes. your mod was fun to begin with. Can't wait for pb3.

The tools look interesting, but the drama isn't seriously it's just a game. The activity of modding is a novelty (people do it because it pleases them to do so get a life and leave them alone)

BTW +rep

[AAA]

How are your weapons and vehicles doing? Made any changes since PB2?

[t3h m00kz]

Awesome job... it's turning out very nicely. The programs are definitely a breakthrough... Personally I suggest releasing the programs if and when they're completed, but that's only because I'm a open source nut and think it would definitely help the H2 modding community... the injector at least. There's so many limitations on H2 at the moment and anything would be helpful.

But that's all up to you guys; just throwing out my two cents.

Not to mention I'm tired as fuck and don't know the whole situation atm

[Kornman00]

Not to mention I'm tired as fuck and don't know the whole situation atm
Well, in a nut shell, basically CAD slept with Masterz's mom...

thing is, this was back in 1989 :o

[CodeBrain]

Needs moar Korny getting to work on H2V :downs:

I believe you still promised us those tools, but SOMEONE wont give back the source, so you cant continue it :(

[Choking Victim]

Awesome job... it's turning out very nicely. The programs are definitely a breakthrough... Personally I suggest releasing the programs if and when they're completed, but that's only because I'm a open source nut and think it would definitely help the H2 modding community... the injector at least. There's so many limitations on H2 at the moment and anything would be helpful.

But that's all up to you guys; just throwing out my two cents.

Not to mention I'm tired as fuck and don't know the whole situation atm
For the 5th time, we're releasing the injector, not the extractor. I don't see why its so hard to read...

[Rosco]

It's quite funny seeing how I know some people who don't like H2 at all, but still want the extractor. Don't give me the ''H2 would be good on H1'' excuse, because we all know at the end of the day people will want their beloved pistol back. ;p

[Amit]

I dunno if this would help but not just lock this thread but delete and repost it again and refresh the shit posting. Then pick it off one by one. Just delete individual shit posts.

[sdavis117]

http://img58.imageshack.us/img58/5702/masterzgotownedmu2.gif



You mind if I use that as an avy?

[p0lar_bear]

Since it's about 800 KB, yes, I do mind.

[sdavis117]

Not here, somewhere else.

[SnaFuBAR]

Wow, I come back to read all this? How ungrateful can a community be? What the hell makes you all think you're so entitled to ANYTHING anyone creates? I swear, nothing is good enough for you people, you're all so pathetic. The majority of you screaming and BITCHING about not having what you want don't even have any need for anything like an animation extractor! Arguing how extracting something you didn't make with a tool you didn't make to put them into CE really shows how lacking the lot of you are about content CREATION. How does anyone benefit at all in that aspect by clicking a few buttons? You don't. You benefit by learning.

AH! AAH! NO! You aren't going to learn ANYTHING by extracting animations and shoving them into another game because you're to damn lazy to learn how to animate!

STOP ACTING SO ENTITLED. YOU DON'T DESERVE ANYTHING.

[t3h m00kz]

For the 5th time, we're releasing the injector, not the extractor. I don't see why its so hard to read...

Don't have to get all snappy man ;o I was tired.

[CodeBrain]

Wow, I come back to read all this? How ungrateful can a community be? What the hell makes you all think you're so entitled to ANYTHING anyone creates? I swear, nothing is good enough for you people, you're all so pathetic. The majority of you screaming and BITCHING about not having what you want don't even have any need for anything like an animation extractor! Arguing how extracting something you didn't make with a tool you didn't make to put them into CE really shows how lacking the lot of you are about content CREATION. How does anyone benefit at all in that aspect by clicking a few buttons? You don't. You benefit by learning.

AH! AAH! NO! You aren't going to learn ANYTHING by extracting animations and shoving them into another game because you're to damn lazy to learn how to animate!

STOP ACTING SO ENTITLED. YOU DON'T DESERVE ANYTHING.

This man speaks the truth.

[Heathen]

Snaf....you seem like an angry dude. I mean, yeah...we'retheir stupid sometimes, but all that had been said and established.Hell, I dont map so I dont really care what you do with your tools.I can see both arguments...so I am impartial. They did say they were releasing the thingy you guys need so whats all the fuss about anyways? The tools seem like they are gonna benefit the community alot so I, as a player, am happy.

[p0lar_bear]

Snaf's just catching up since he was banned for three weeks. :v:

The whole line of discussion of what is and isn't being released is officially over as of now.

[TK421]

Long-time lurker, first-time poster here.
Not all those guests were Google bots! >=U

Anyway, so what maps are you guys making again for PB3? Zanzi and Terminal?

[ShadowSpartan]

Long-time lurker, first-time poster here.
Not all those guests were Google bots! >=U

Anyway, so what maps are you guys making again for PB3? Zanzi and Terminal?
We haven't chosen which maps will be released for pb3.

[DarkHalo003]

Since it's about 800 KB, yes, I do mind.
awww........:(

Terminal looks great so far though. I wonder how often people will get splattered by the train now......:lol:

[AAA]

Everyone will definately be making some good gameplay and story videos out of Terminal like in Halo 2. Next to that, the gameplay in general will be fun as hell.

I"m so happy. :)

[ODX]

I wonder how often people will get splattered by the train now......:lol:
Uh...probably a lot. Watch there be about 5 servers with the name 'GET SPLATTERD BY T3H TRAIN!!!111!!1one!1'

[sdavis117]

I remember a big thing in the Halo 2 Terminal was to try and destroy the train.

All those splattered tanks. The horror.

I wonder what an H3 remake of Terminal would be like. Do eet Bungie.

[SnaFuBAR]

we should get all 16 players stacked up on the tracks and watch the carnage ensue.

[Apoc4lypse]

im way too lazy to read this whole topic ugh...

I'll just say, amazing work at getting animation injection to work XD

As for the extractor.. what ever its yours.

Good work :)


model injection next mebe? hehe

[Invader Veex]

model injection next mebe? hehe

Hasn't that already been done?

[CtrlAltDestroy]

Not properly.

[ultama121]

Current model injection is an eye sore :smith:.

[ODX]

we should get all 16 players stacked up on the tracks and watch the carnage ensue.
1) I don't think we could get 16 people to cooperate and stand on top of each other and,
2) Needs moar ragdoll.
3) Was that sarcasm at all? Just to make sure?

[Pyong Kawaguchi]

Heres a better idea, create a clone gun, and spawn 1000 clones there with full ragdoll
Lulz will ensue :D

[ODX]

I thought it was impossible to have ragdoll in Halo CE...unless...*stares at CAD*

[AAA]

*GASP!*

REVEAL YOUR SECRETS!!

[Syuusuke]

1) I don't think we could get 16 people to cooperate and stand on top of each other and,
2) Needs moar ragdoll.
3) Was that sarcasm at all? Just to make sure?

1. Doesn't hurt to try.
2. Not sure about this
3. Sarcastic or not, it would be a funny moment. It doesn't seem sarcastic...You never know, SnaF might model a real life train and kill 16 people.

[SnaFuBAR]

1. Doesn't hurt to try.
2. Not sure about this
3. Sarcastic or not, it would be a funny moment. It doesn't seem sarcastic...You never know, SnaF might model a real life train and kill 16 people.
guys, brb, tying syuusuke to the rails for snitching.

[Pooky]

we should get all 16 players stacked up on the tracks and watch the carnage ensue.

As well as all possible vehicles, right?

[n00b1n8R]

1) I don't think we could get 16 people to cooperate and stand on top of each other and,

Apparently you never played on the old face clan servers. We used to do stupid crap like that all the time.

Oh god, I'm beggining to look back on face with nostalgia D:

[Apoc4lypse]

Hasn't that already been done?

I don't even know... I don't plan on modding anything much more then what I can on my current pc set up (not h2 vista or halo 2 unless I mod my xbox which is unlikely, not until I buy a 360 at least) Once I get a 360 I'll probably start modding my old box and getting into halo 2zie's stuff and trying to mod that, I have a feeling it'll be a lot like modding halo 1 again before CE. Thats my current plans... of course that doesn't all start happening until I purchase a 360, even then I'll have to wait till I play a bunch of 360 games and get bored, then I'll move onto modding my old box.

Then eventually one day my pc will get upgraded, and my pc shenanigans will start all over again, its a vicious cycle really and its speed is controlled by my current expendable funds in possession and also directly related to how bored I am with my life... :D