Norway Shootings and whatnot

[Rainbow Dash]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/07/22/oslo-blast.html

[Bodzilla]

CeoRqZ6mWzQ

[Limited]

Simple unbelievable, even yesterday I could not believe a human being could do this kind of atrocity. What scares me is how personal the killings were, he told children to walk up to him, and once they did he shot them twice in the head, later shooting some in the head with a shotgun. I've seen a picture of a boy knee deep in water begging for his life, pretty sure he was killed also. The fact they were children tears my heart out to all the families effected.

I'm also shocked he didnt have a gun fight with police, and that he didnt kill himself. I heard yesterday that the maximum time he would get is 22 years, I'm assuming because they don't stack jail time for multiple killings...I'm pretty sure Norway will make an example out of him and he will never walk on free soil again.

[Rainbow Dash]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/07/24/norway-attacks.html

dude is fucked up

Also since I see a lot of people on the cbc bring up the maximum penalty for this crime being 20 something years in prison, saying he should be executed, etc, I'd just like to throw this out:

Norway has an excellent prison system, that is radically different from your American joke of a penal system, hopefully in that time he'll improve himself, and if not, I'm sure there are provisions in place to ensure he doesn't get a chance at this again. At the very least though, they're sticking to their principles and laws, which is more than admirable, considering the people upholding them are the ones who had an attempt on their lives made by this man.

[Limited]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/07/24/norway-attacks.html

dude is fucked up

Also since I see a lot of people on the cbc bring up the maximum penalty for this crime being 20 something years in prison, saying he should be executed, etc, I'd just like to throw this out:

Norway has an excellent prison system, that is radically different from your American joke of a penal system, hopefully in that time he'll improve himself, and if not, I'm sure there are provisions in place to ensure he doesn't get a chance at this again. At the very least though, they're sticking to their principles and laws, which is more than admirable, considering the people upholding them are the ones who had an attempt on their lives made by this man.
This individual is a serial killer, a brutal mass murderer who has no respect for life. He says it does not feel any guilt, he admits to the killings but does not think he breaks the law.

He should never see the light of day, I don't care if Norway has a great prison system and can turn offenders back into civil humans, this attack is on another level.

[=sw=warlord]

The guy was extremely well prepared and had written a very large manifesto.
If nothing else this guy needs to be in the isolation ward.
The guy seems to be a part of the current Neo Nazi moment. (http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Norway-Massacre-Suspect-Anders-Behring-Breiviks-Manifesto-Blueprint-For-Revolution---Tim-Marshall/Article/201107416036509?lpos=World_News_Carousel_Region_1&lid=ARTICLE_16036509_Norway_Massacre%3A_Suspect_An ders_Behring_Breiviks_Manifesto_Blueprint_For_Revo lution_-_Tim_Marshall)
I suppose you get rid of one person and another shows their ugly face.

As much as I doubt this will happen, I honestly hope this doesn't end up as some kind of shock level in MW3, Activision are known for wanting to add shock and awe to their CoD franchise...
{cough london underground cough]

[Bodzilla]

fuck rights standards and precedents ey limited!

that mindset is how the patriot act got in alright, clam down man, it's their country let them do it their way, which has been proven to work.

[Rainbow Dash]

this attack is on another level.

I'm not denying that, but if there's anything his kind wants, it's to destroy what makes Norway great, and if they go and change things (arguably for the worse) just for him then he's already won.

Also what bod said.

[Limited]

fuck rights standards and precedents ey limited!

that mindset is how the patriot act got in alright, clam down man, it's their country let them do it their way, which has been proven to work.
Norway has never had a terror attack that was conducted by a Norwegian, therefore "proven to work" is made moot. Changes will be made after this occurred, its undeniable. Does that mean he won? No.

Also the man had links with EDL, so its not solely Norways issue.

[Rainbow Dash]

Does that mean he won? Yes.


fixed4u

[Patrickssj6]

I heard yesterday that the maximum time he would get is 22 years.
There are many countries where life sentence is limited (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_imprisonment).

This incident showed one again how the media goes for ratings and invents facts just to get viewers onto the screen.

[Mr Buckshot]

This individual is a serial killer, a brutal mass murderer who has no respect for life. He says it does not feel any guilt, he admits to the killings but does not think he breaks the law.

He should never see the light of day, I don't care if Norway has a great prison system and can turn offenders back into civil humans, this attack is on another level.

like others said, whether or not you agree with the sentence, it's their country. Let them deal with him their way.

in the past I might have openly agreed with you but all that will do is just kick up drama (you probably already know who's most likely to get provoked) and I guess if public awareness of the guy is sufficiently high there's not much chance of him being a threat when he's out.

[Limited]

If he is deemed a threat to the public then they can extend the sentence, therefore they do not need to change any legislation.

My thoughts are if someone kills 93 people and has no guilt and when they commit the act in such a calm manner then I feel they pose further risk. He took 9 years to plan the attack, it was a calculated mass murder on a massive scale. He is a dangerous monster, would you feel happy to be in the same room as him?

[Patrickssj6]

So where is your point again? If, after 22 years, he is still a threat they will just extend his sentence.

It is a very humane thing to give that guy a chance after 22 years to ameliorate. After all no one is born this way and 22 years is more than you can imagine.

[Ifafudafi]

Getting away from the prison shitestorm for a bit, have a look at this

"Norway Suspect Used Call of Duty to Train for Massacre" (http://blogs.forbes.com/johngaudiosi/2011/07/24/norway-suspect-used-activisions-call-of-duty-to-train-for-massacre/?goback=%2Egde_41047_member_63262290)

The fact that he used MW2 to "train" isn't so much the interesting bit; he actually thinks the MP "...can more or less completely simulate actual operations" (probably a good thing for Norway that he didn't get his hands on an actual military sim)

It's how he talks about using WoW both as a means of isolation and, more interestingly, as a sort of cover for his actual weapon training. Apparently by telling the people who would otherwise check up on him that he's shamefully developed a WoW addiction, his loved ones were so embarrased by the matter that they didn't ask any questions or tell anyone about his otherwise unusual behavior. I think it's intriguing how the social stigma of being really into video games (let's ignore that it's WoW for a second) is that strong; perhaps it's just Norway or just his family, but, being ordinarily in video game-friendly company myself, it really strikes me how much weight the gamers-are-loners-are-freaks mindset still holds in people's minds.

(and before anyone gets any ideas, no, I don't think video games are responsible for his actions; I think the fact that he's a whacked out nutjob who adopted significant portions of his "manifesto" from the Unabomber may have had a little more relevance)

[Mr Buckshot]

COD is a good military simulator?

Awesome. Didn't know I can draw my knife, fatally stab someone who's wearing kevlar, then holster the knife again in the blink of an eye!

[Pooky]

If I posted what I really think about all this it would probably just piss everyone off. Suffice to say, the death penalty would be way too merciful for this guy.

[=sw=warlord]

If I posted what I really think about all this it would probably just piss everyone off. Suffice to say, the death penalty would be way too merciful for this guy.

Like I mentioned, total isolation would be worthy, not even a light in the room so it's pitch black.

[sleepy1212]

I don't think it matters to him what the sentence is. He said somewhere that this attack was more or less an advertising campaign for his manifesto so I suppose he expects others to pick up the "torch" regardless of what happens to him. A more fitting punishment would be to destroy his writings.

Does anyone else think it's weird to send your kids to a political summer camp? I mean, didn't the nazis do that?

[=sw=warlord]

Does anyone else think it's weird to send your kids to a political summer camp? I mean, didn't the nazis do that?

The Nazi's also treated their own whilst holding prejudice against other "races", what's your point?
Political summer camp is no more "extreme" than a religious one or any other idealistic camp.
If you're implying that having a political summer camp automatically makes Norway Nazi then you're looking at this from the wrong angle.

This guy is assuming the rest of the Neo Nazi movement will follow in his foot steps, I would imagine that if they're capable of planning something like this, then they are also smart enough that the general population still has a very bad viewpoint of the Nazi's as a whole, the name has afterall been converted into an insult [See: Grammar Nazi].

[Limited]

Looks like his lawyer is pulling the insanity card, pathetic.

[=sw=warlord]

Looks like his lawyer is pulling the insanity card, pathetic.

This surprises you?
How could you not see this one coming, had that guy up cumbria in the UK not killed himself he would have ended up pulling the insanity card as well.
Personally I would prefer if they held him in a padded cell, saves the trouble of worrying over whether he spreads his views to other cell mates.

[Bodzilla]

Something i see quoted a fuckton when talking about guns and government is...
"he who gives up rights for security deserves neither"

and look what we fucking have in this thread.
Pretty hypocritical posting from a shitload of people in this thread i have to say.

[Limited]

How is that quote linked to this event Bod? The security guard on the island didn't have a gun.

[Rainbow Dash]

We have people talking about taking away someone's rights for their own security. Sounds pretty fitting to me.

[Limited]

We have people talking about taking away someone's rights for their own security. Sounds pretty fitting to me.
The killer took away the right to live off 76 people.

Its a possibly he could be put in the most luxurious prison in the world.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/07/26/article-2018917-0D2B244700000578-96_634x431.jpg
Luxury: Every private cell has a mini-fridge, flat-screen TV and even a private en-suite bathroom and barless windows to let in more sunlight.

Is that justice?

[=sw=warlord]

He's in solitude, no interaction with anyone, just because he has an IKEA cell doesn't make it luxurious.

[neuro]

The killer took away the right to live off 76 people.

Its a possibly he could be put in the most luxurious prison in the world.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/07/26/article-2018917-0D2B244700000578-96_634x431.jpg
Luxury: Every private cell has a mini-fridge, flat-screen TV and even a private en-suite bathroom and barless windows to let in more sunlight.

Is that justice?

oh no, because the american justice system performs so great at converting people sentenced to jail back into good citizens?

narrowminded much?

[Patrickssj6]

Limited, even though your room looks like that you should go outside and enjoy the sun a bit more...might breath some freedom while you are at it.

[Limited]

The prison cost £150,000,000 and holds only 252 prisoners.

"Despite housing some of Norway's most dangerous criminals, including murderers, paedophiles and rapists, it has all the facilities found in a high-class hotel.

It is spread over 75 acres of peaceful woodland, and includes jogging routes outside, gym including climbing walls, and a two-bedroom house for prisoners to stay with their families for several nights away from the main building."

They treat their inmates like royalty, no wonder he didnt kill himself, he figured he would live it up 'behind bars'.

[Mr Buckshot]

fine and dandy if they want to have a humane prison... but Internet access? access to live media of any kind (besides radio stations) is taking it a bit too far, considering this guy posts at Stormfront.

[Rainbow Dash]

01mTKDaKa6Q

[PenGuin1362]

I mean the idea behind a prison is more so to reform these days rather than torture, and clearly here in America our system is not working. I've read nothing on this "IKEA" prison but when somethings not working maybe another approach is needed. No harm in giving it a shot I guess, so long as it isn't cycling dangerous murders back into society. Despite that, this guy should probably just be executed, screw prison.

[Bodzilla]

letting people rot in a concrete box has never workes to reform people.

why on earth would you endorse such a stupid fucking philosophy.
If you dont think the purpose of a prison is to reform people into rational human beings then why not just support capital punishment for all people who commit any number of these offenses.

[PenGuin1362]

either I'm misreading you or you misread me >.>

[Bodzilla]

you guys think that giving them some items which isn't standard practice in a proven to fail prison system is luxury.

if you support a broken prison system over something thats been proven to work..... your fucking stupid.
Putting a person in a concrete box is wasted fucking potential, and if you feel that is an ideal outcome for people that have committed crimes then why not just support capital punishment and have them killed if there's no possible way for them to become a benefit to society, after all it'd be a hell of alot fucking cheaper.

Choose wisely.

[Limited]

Go look at the poverty rates for England and America and now look at the prison in question, we are talking about people who have committed the most hanous crimes, the most dispicable and horrible crimes, and we are giving them extra comfortable beds, television sets and all the rest. Why are they giving the worst kind of people a nice live? Why are we giving them a chance to reform?

If we were talking about people who have committed petty/small crimes like theft or even accidental manslaughter where the convict shows remorse and guilt. Those people should have the chance of reform. And they at the people that should be in this prison.

Death penalty? Im on the fence and here's why, people who committ such horrible crimes, multiple murders, mass murder etc, the death penalty is too easy for them, it's the easy way out for them. No they should have to suffer, just like they made their victims. Death penalty does make financial sense though.


If this prison was in England, there would be an uproar.

[Patrickssj6]

I mean the idea behind a prison is more so to reform these days rather than torture,
this this and this.


No they should have to suffer, just like they made their victims. Death penalty does make financial sense though.

I love how people always talk about Nazis not realising they are closer to the ideology than they think.

Once again a human being is not born this way. His childhood environment forms him and just because no one detected his anomaly, he should be given a second chance in prison.

If you put him in a rotting cell it is far more likely that his hatred towards society will increase. A prison cell should be fitted so that the only thing in there he can confront is his conscience.

[king_nothing_]

Go look at the poverty rates for England and America and now look at the prison in question, we are talking about people who have committed the most hanous crimes, the most dispicable and horrible crimes, and we are giving them extra comfortable beds, television sets and all the rest. Why are they giving the worst kind of people a nice live? Why are we giving them a chance to reform?
"We"? It's in Norway.


Death penalty does make financial sense though.
It costs more to execute someone than it does to incarcerate them for life in the US.

[Bodzilla]

Go look at the poverty rates for England and America and now look at the prison in question, we are talking about people who have committed the most hanous crimes, the most dispicable and horrible crimes, and we are giving them extra comfortable beds, television sets and all the rest. Why are they giving the worst kind of people a nice live? Why are we giving them a chance to reform?
Then kill them and carry around the responsibility of taking someone else's life.

[Rainbow Dash]

no shut up guys two wrongs make a right !!!!!

[Limited]

Yeah he made plans to attack a decommissed nuclear plant 20 miles from where I live, my sister works in the building next to it. So you will see why I hate this man with a passion.

[neuro]

hating a guy is a poor excuse for being stupid.

[Limited]

Bod clearly didnt read my whole post and looks like others didn't too. I also question the prison system in Norway.

[Bodzilla]

WHY QUESTION SOMETHING THAT FUCKING WORKS WHEN WHAT YOUR SUGGESTING IS SOMETHING THAT DOESNT

HEY GUYS I HATE IT WHEN SHIT MAKES SENSE SO I TRY TO BE AS RETARDED AS POSSIBLE!

[=sw=warlord]

Bod clearly didnt read my whole post and looks like others didn't too. I also question the prison system in Norway.

Limited, your stupidity is really showing.
You're claiming than our prison system is more effective compared to the one in Norway when it has been shown to be the reverse.
The prison system is not to torture, maim or otherwise cause more harm, it's design is simple; to give those who feel they are above the law to reform themselves or face the consequences of never having their freedom back.
That is the down right truth, nothing more nothing less.

The reason people are in poverty is because they live in an uncontrolled environment, a prison is a controlled environment you cannot possibly compare the two.
If you can reform people to become beneficial to society and use that intelligence and ingenuity for something to better the rest of society then it is something worth doing.
We no longer live in the 60's where insane people were tied to beds and beaten to submission, nor do we live in the middle ages where convicts were tied to posts in the village to be stoned to death.
You may want to remember what time frame we live in and remember we have advanced much more than you seem to think.

[Limited]

Bod I have already said that norways leglislation is not up to scratch. How much jail time does a murderer get? 3 months per victim, is that justice?

Warlord, never did I compare englands prison system, all I said was if their expensive and lavish prison was here would be a uproar by the tax payers. The poverty reference was to the cost spent to keep the men there.

Fine, fuck prison, let's send him off to Guantanamo, or have you guys forgotten that exists.

[Rainbow Dash]

Better idea, let's send you back to school

[Patrickssj6]

+rep

[=sw=warlord]

Warlord, never did I compare englands prison system, all I said was if their expensive and lavish prison was here would be a uproar by the tax payers. The poverty reference was to the cost spent to keep the men there.



That's only because the general tax payer is used to bent politicians using their money for their own selfish reasons, I'm sure if they were informed that the money was being wisely spent for once and actually making a difference there would not be such an uproar.

[Bodzilla]

Better idea, let's send you back to school
http://notfourchan.net/trap/src/129776272675.jpg

[leorimolo]

No one else gets the feeling, these terrorist attacks are just too perfect. Attacking the country with the best prisons, being a blonde blue eyed guy, owning an organic farm, and then decides to blow shit up. Then liberal media kicks in and makes it a "tragedy"

I kinda realized 9/11 was completely a false flag attack, I don't know what to believe anymore.

[Patrickssj6]

Norway is known for this kind of stuff (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1G1GGLQ_ENUS303&q=church%20burnings&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=27l1029l0l1161l10l5l0l0l0l0l0l0ll0&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&biw=1920&bih=1070)...probably the depressive weather :P