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0m3g4Muff1n987
February 3rd, 2008, 04:14 PM
Which would be better: Radeon HD2600 512MB (http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Xplorer_X64-7000_Notebook), or GeForce 8600GT 512MB (http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Xplorer_X7-7500_Notebook/)? I'm not trying to start a brand war, I'm just trying to figure out which is better in this case. I don't want to hear about why one brand is better in general, only for these two cards because I'm sure one of them is what I'll eventually get.

Also, what's the difference between 256MB of memory and 512MB for both brands? I heard that even if you have more memory, it hardly helps because the card can't make use of all of it at once or something like that.

BobtheGreatII
February 3rd, 2008, 04:21 PM
Good luck getting a computer from Cyberpower, my dad got one and he's sent it back 3 times, then they sent him another new one, and it still didn't work. I've always been a fan of ATI but that's just me. I'm not sure which is better.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 3rd, 2008, 04:23 PM
Oh yeah... I forgot, I don't want to hear about how cyberpower and ibuypower and anything that ends in -power is crappy, because I know lots of people from halomods who have had no problems with those computers.

BobtheGreatII
February 3rd, 2008, 04:24 PM
Yah, I get that, I was just saying. You should understand what you're getting into.

SnaFuBAR
February 3rd, 2008, 05:04 PM
i've had both, and imo, the 2600xt performed better.

Xetsuei
February 3rd, 2008, 06:56 PM
i've had both, and imo, the 2600xt performed better.

Yeah, the 2600XT is the better of the two.

343guiltymc
February 3rd, 2008, 08:13 PM
Oh yeah... I forgot, I don't want to hear about how cyberpower and ibuypower and anything that ends in -power is crappy, because I know lots of people from halomods who have had no problems with those computers.
Just because they're is okay doesn't mean the one you are getting is going to be good, don't you know Cyberpower has 26 percent failure rates? :rolleyes:

Xetsuei
February 3rd, 2008, 08:27 PM
Oh yeah... I forgot, I don't want to hear about how cyberpower and ibuypower and anything that ends in -power is crappy, because I know lots of people from halomods who have had no problems with those computers.

They suck, don't buy any of them, you could build a better one on your own for cheaper.


Just because they're is okay doesn't mean the one you are getting is going to be good, don't you know Cyberpower has 26 percent failure rates? :rolleyes:

That's a 1 in 4 failure rate, basically they suck ass.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 4th, 2008, 06:32 AM
Alright, whatever.

And I don't think those are 2600XT's, only 2600's. Not XT.

Snowy
February 4th, 2008, 08:39 AM
There's no such thing as Just 2600's. Only 2600XT's and Pros. Maybe for OEMS, I might be wrong. Check the clock speeds on them.

If it's an 8600GT < 2600XT. If it's 8600GTS > 2600XT.

Regardless though, they both suck.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 4th, 2008, 04:57 PM
There's only XT's and Pros? I never knew that. I could've sworn I saw a few 2600's on Newegg one time.

Hm. Well, anyway, a 2600XT is a good bang for the buck IMO and it's pretty damn good for a laptop, isn't it? Some of you guys suggested the 8600GT to someone on here before. So the 2600XT must be good.

SnaFuBAR
February 4th, 2008, 06:27 PM
There's no such thing as Just 2600's. Only 2600XT's and Pros. Maybe for OEMS, I might be wrong. Check the clock speeds on them.

If it's an 8600GT < 2600XT. If it's 8600GTS > 2600XT.

Regardless though, they both suck.
sorry, but i had the 8600gts overclock, and the 2600xt is better than it. Also, they don't suck, they're decent midrange cards.

Xetsuei
February 4th, 2008, 08:08 PM
sorry, but i had the 8600gts overclock, and the 2600xt is better than it. Also, they don't suck, they're decent midrange cards.

They both suck, and they're the only mid range DX10 cards in existence.

343guiltymc
February 4th, 2008, 09:07 PM
Xetsuei™;218770']They both suck, and they're the only mid range DX10 cards in existence.
What happened to the 3850? :confused2:

Xetsuei
February 5th, 2008, 12:25 AM
What happened to the 3850? :confused2:

I wouldn't really consider the 38#0 mid range because they own the shit out of the 8600s and the 2600s.

343guiltymc
February 5th, 2008, 03:39 PM
Xetsuei™;218836']I wouldn't really consider the 38#0 mid range because they own the shit out of the 8600s and the 2600s.
Regardless the 3850 is still around the mid range price, although it's might a bit higher.

Amit
February 5th, 2008, 05:11 PM
Regardless the 3850 is still around the mid range price, although it's might a bit higher.

Regardless of what you just said, the HD 3850s are high-end video cards for a mid-range price and they have a huge performance increase over the fastest 8600GTS or Radeon HD 2600Xt out there. You may bitch to me about the 3850s being mid-high range video cards but save it. Benchmarks show excellent performance on the 3850s. If the price for a 3870 just spontaneously fell tomorrow to about $210, it's still a high-end video card.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 5th, 2008, 05:14 PM
Hm, so then are the HD 3850's around the same price as a 2600XT (give or take, idk, $100)? And if so, do they come in notebook flavors? And if not, has ATI announced when?

343guiltymc
February 5th, 2008, 05:39 PM
Hm, so then are the HD 3850's around the same price as a 2600XT (give or take, idk, $100)? And if so, do they come in notebook flavors? And if not, has ATI announced when?
Negative, 3850 costs way more than 100 dollars, and does not exist for laptops. Never heard of any news on moving it to mobile. You're better off just buying a desktop, considering how little you seem to be willing to spend on a good gaming laptop.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 5th, 2008, 05:53 PM
I said give or take $100 relative to the 2600XT's price. And ok. But I am not getting a desktop! I know how so much easier it would be, I mean, it seems like god is teasing me with all the benefits, but I simply can't, because I need a laptop :mad:

I really don't even need a very portable one. All I really need is a good desktop replacement. I'll even make a list of where I would be taking it:

-Bathroom for crapping
-Friend's house, who lives in the neighborhood, and who I always get a car ride over to anyway
-Maybe a couple vacations, if my parents let me.

And I think that's pretty much it. I want to be able to play games fairly well, do schoolwork (and that's why it needs to be at least sort of portable) and browse the internet. That's it.

Warsaw
February 5th, 2008, 06:30 PM
Well, if you just need it to be sort of portable, and are willing to give up just the ability to bring it into the bathroom (seriously man, print out your porn so you don't risk getting your computer dirty), you might consider building a MicroATX computer in a case such as the XQPack or another case of similar dimensions. They are small and easily transportable, and offer almost all the benefits of a full ATX computer (though you may need to get creative with wiring).

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 5th, 2008, 09:01 PM
That would be a great idea, but bringing over even a microATX computer with the cables and monitor and all would be kind of awkward.

But just for the purpose of research and curiosity, if I wanted to get the smallest case possible, while still retaining reasonable power, and still being able to fit one or two decent graphics cards in, what kind of tower would I go about getting? Newegg's got microATX mid-tower, mini-tower, slim tower, and stuff like that. I want to be able to fit decent stuff in, but still have a small case so it can be movable.

Warsaw
February 5th, 2008, 09:13 PM
APEVIA X-QPACK 2
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811144141

or

APEVIA X-QPACK
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811144109

And, since stock PSUs should never be relied upon (And because we like them to match the case if we need to replace them):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817148008


Please note that the above cases come in a very large variety of colors. They are small, can fit just about any "full size" items in (if you manage your cables properly), and it remains portable. Wires are not that big of a deal unless you are like me, and haul over a 5.1 system to every LAN you go to. All you have is the monitor, keyboard, mouse, power cable, and a headset.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 5th, 2008, 09:19 PM
Hm. Ok, I'm keeping my eye on the X-QPACK 2. But really, why should I spend an extra $60 on a PSU, when there's already one included in the case? What can't I trust about the included one? Is it really that big of a factor to buy a whole separate PSU?

Warsaw
February 5th, 2008, 09:37 PM
Well, just reading over the reviews on both case styles, many have stated that the stock one has failed not too long after their purchase. If you want to take your chances, be my guest, it's your money.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 6th, 2008, 06:36 AM
Ok, I'm cheap, I'll chance it if I end up buying it.

So it seems if I do get a microATX mobo, I won't be able to fit more than one PCIe card in (graphics card) and 2 PCI cards (probably an X-Fi sound card and either a wireless card or Verizon card). That sucks. I wanted to be able to possibly fit 2 cards in SLI, and I don't really mind the PCI but only one PCIe slot? That's crap.

Amit
February 6th, 2008, 04:46 PM
Negative, 3850 costs way more than 100 dollars, and does not exist for laptops. Never heard of any news on moving it to mobile. You're better off just buying a desktop, considering how little you seem to be willing to spend on a good gaming laptop.

He was talking about the price added to the 2600XT. Here in Ontario I can get the Sapphire HD 3850 256MB for the same price as the ATI HD 2600XT. But I think I'm gonna save up even more and get the Sapphire Atomic HD 3870 for around $280.


I said give or take $100 relative to the 2600XT's price. And ok. But I am not getting a desktop! I know how so much easier it would be, I mean, it seems like god is teasing me with all the benefits, but I simply can't, because I need a laptop :mad:

I really don't even need a very portable one. All I really need is a good desktop replacement. I'll even make a list of where I would be taking it:

-Bathroom for crapping
-Friend's house, who lives in the neighborhood, and who I always get a car ride over to anyway
-Maybe a couple vacations, if my parents let me.

And I think that's pretty much it. I want to be able to play games fairly well, do schoolwork (and that's why it needs to be at least sort of portable) and browse the internet. That's it.

If you're taking it to school, how can you have a mATX PC still. IF you're not going to take it to school, well why did you write that you need it to be portable for school needs?



So it seems if I do get a microATX mobo, I won't be able to fit more than one PCIe card in (graphics card) and 2 PCI cards (probably an X-Fi sound card and either a wireless card or Verizon card). That sucks. I wanted to be able to possibly fit 2 cards in SLI, and I don't really mind the PCI but only one PCIe slot? That's crap.

As far as I know, there are no multiple PCI-E x16 slot SLI or CrossFire micro-ATX motherboards. So chill out man. I checked on Newegg and didn't find anything. I did see an article on google a while back about eVga having SLI boards but I dunno.

Warsaw
February 6th, 2008, 07:56 PM
IAWTP ^

Most laptops also don't support more than one PCI-Express slot either, so either way, you are stuck buddy.

Also, while they are not the newest and nor are they the greatest motherboards, there are some mATX motherboards that do, in fact, support multiple PCIe x16 cards:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010200280+1075707619+1073607588&Configurator=&Subcategory=280&description=&Ntk=&srchInDesc=

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 6th, 2008, 09:36 PM
Hm. K. BTW, my dad just came up with the perfect idea for solving my problem. I won't tell you guys, because I might actually want to get it patented or something (yes, it's that good.) but it pretty much makes the biggest parts of a desktop that you wouldn't want to move around (ie, monitor, keyboard, etc.) almost very portable. So if I were to go to a hotel, I'd just pack my desktop and my device, plug the desktop in, plug in my device to the desktop by whatever connections are necessary, probably USB, and away I go.

We're going to see what we can do with getting some old computer parts, rerouting some wires and soldering some stuff. If it works, we'll probably go to my dad's rich friend, who invented ethernet (I'm fucking serious; my dad knows him personally) and hopefully get it sold somewhere.

343guiltymc
February 6th, 2008, 09:54 PM
Hm. K. BTW, my dad just came up with the perfect idea for solving my problem. I won't tell you guys, because I might actually want to get it patented or something (yes, it's that good.) but it pretty much makes the biggest parts of a desktop that you wouldn't want to move around (ie, monitor, keyboard, etc.) almost very portable. So if I were to go to a hotel, I'd just pack my desktop and my device, plug the desktop in, plug in my device to the desktop by whatever connections are necessary, probably USB, and away I go.

We're going to see what we can do with getting some old computer parts, rerouting some wires and soldering some stuff. If it works, we'll probably go to my dad's rich friend, who invented ethernet (I'm fucking serious; my dad knows him personally) and hopefully get it sold somewhere.
Can't wait to see how that turns out. :rolleyes:

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 6th, 2008, 10:05 PM
You probably think I'm crazy, don't you? :P Maybe I am. :D

Warsaw
February 6th, 2008, 10:29 PM
Hm. K. BTW, my dad just came up with the perfect idea for solving my problem. I won't tell you guys, because I might actually want to get it patented or something (yes, it's that good.) but it pretty much makes the biggest parts of a desktop that you wouldn't want to move around (ie, monitor, keyboard, etc.) almost very portable. So if I were to go to a hotel, I'd just pack my desktop and my device, plug the desktop in, plug in my device to the desktop by whatever connections are necessary, probably USB, and away I go.

We're going to see what we can do with getting some old computer parts, rerouting some wires and soldering some stuff. If it works, we'll probably go to my dad's rich friend, who invented ethernet (I'm fucking serious; my dad knows him personally) and hopefully get it sold somewhere.

Sounds essentially like a computer in a briefcase. You put the monitor on one side, keyboard on the other, and mouse lying somewhere in there. All you do is open it, plug into the separate computer, plug into the wall, and you are good to go.

SnaFuBAR
February 7th, 2008, 03:12 PM
Dell did that already.:eyesroll:

CrAsHOvErRide
February 7th, 2008, 03:32 PM
You probably think I'm crazy, don't you? :P Maybe I am. :D
You are. Amen.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 7th, 2008, 04:07 PM
It's not a separate computer, it's gutted. But I'll tell you guys if it worked after we find a dead laptop.

Amit
February 7th, 2008, 05:11 PM
Can't wait to see how that turns out. :rolleyes:

:raise:


Dell did that already.:eyesroll:

:-3


It's not a separate computer, it's gutted. But I'll tell you guys if it worked after we find a dead laptop.

:tinfoil:

OOO...cyborg laptop...:iiam:

ImSpartacus
February 7th, 2008, 05:44 PM
Dell did that already.:eyesroll:
Goddamn dell, they're like the Simpsons, they do everything.

343guiltymc
February 7th, 2008, 08:33 PM
Goddamn dell, they're like the Simpsons, they do everything.
Except make good PCs.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 7th, 2008, 08:53 PM
lol @ last 3 posts.

ImSpartacus
February 10th, 2008, 08:38 PM
Except make good PCs.

I for one think that dell makes excellent pc's, much better than anything someone could build themselves. :lie:

as for the problem at hand, I say just get a decent gaming desktop and a cheap media laptop.

there's actually a killer dell deal right now (IRONY ALERT). Its a 600$ vostro (business inspiron, basically the same thing).

http://i.dell.com/img.aspx?p=b247b2YAypWAoaJlMA6SPiUgXgzSpQh7bL%2fre yNXkjhxZjBa2LlAYlbzoCp3WpslOHlBbcK4UUFS9LFtd2eKf2w zCkrDoxgMDa76KncBwA%3d%3d
It's got a 9 cell battery, 2 gb of ram, a cheap c2d, 160 gb hdd, dvd burner, and an 8400m gs.

the gs wont take u far, but i would never use a laptop for gaming anyway.

i also wouldnt do this desktop in a box, but im interested in how you will pull it off. theres a lot more stuff that can break than in a laptop (theyre made to move).

cooling will be a big problem. you will need to build some vents into this breifcase thing.

also make sure there's nothing on the mobo that could break off (big cpu heatsink, gpu addon coolers, etc.).

basically u will have to make it lan party proof

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 10th, 2008, 09:54 PM
Hm. That does look good. But I don't think I'm going to get a laptop at all now. I think I'll keep this one as my crap one and get a good desktop.

BTW, that link links to the "customize" image, not the page.:lol:

Warsaw
February 10th, 2008, 10:28 PM
If he wants to take it to LANs, the only worthy options are X-QPacks or toughing it out and hauling a full ATX sized computer.

Also, I lol'd at '80s laptops...

Xetsuei
February 11th, 2008, 01:29 AM
I for one think that dell makes excellent pc's, much better than anything someone could build themselves. :lie:

Die in a fire.

StankBacon
February 11th, 2008, 02:20 AM
I for one think that dell makes excellent pc's, much better than anything someone could build themselves.

LMFAO!!

i really hope that was a joke.

Warsaw
February 11th, 2008, 04:10 PM
I for one think that dell makes excellent pc's, much better than anything someone could build themselves. :lie:

Way to notice the smiley on the end people.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 11th, 2008, 05:19 PM
Haha. Wow.

Um... even if I do make the sacrifice of getting a tiny-ass mobo with only one PCIe x16 slot and crammed space and stuff with a mATX case, it won't make much difference because 1. I wouldn't be taking the thing anywhere besides my friend's house, maybe and 2. I would carry the computer in one of my hands, separate from the rest of my crap that I would bring in a backpack. So it wouldn't make much difference if I had a smaller computer, because if carrying some more weight means tons more power with more mobo features, I'm willing to sacrifice some energy :p

Warsaw
February 11th, 2008, 06:15 PM
So basically this topic was a useless merry-go-round?

Also, there are mATX boards with two PCI-Express slots, see previous page.

343guiltymc
February 11th, 2008, 08:40 PM
Just wow..........First you said firmly that you weren't getting a desktop no matter what, and now out of no where you say you want to get a desktop? What's wrong with you, wasting 5 pages worth of responses for nothing?

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 11th, 2008, 10:42 PM
Yup. Sry.

ImSpartacus
February 13th, 2008, 06:46 PM
Xetsuei™;220382']
I for one think that dell makes excellent pc's, much better than anything someone could build themselves. :lie:

Die in a fire. Durdurdur, I r artard.


I for one think that dell makes excellent pc's, much better than anything someone could build themselves.

LMFAO!!

i really hope know with all my heart that was a joke.

:withstupid:


I for one think that dell makes excellent pc's, much better than anything someone could build themselves. :lie:

Way to notice the smiley on the end people.

Oh and by the way, I am fucking brilliant.
:ohsnap::mysterysolved:

ImSpartacus
February 13th, 2008, 06:54 PM
Haha. Wow.

Um... even if I do make the sacrifice of getting a tiny-ass mobo with only one PCIe x16 slot and crammed space and stuff with a mATX case, it won't make much difference because 1. I wouldn't be taking the thing anywhere besides my friend's house, maybe and 2. I would carry the computer in one of my hands, separate from the rest of my crap that I would bring in a backpack. So it wouldn't make much difference if I had a smaller computer, because if carrying some more weight means tons more power with more mobo features, I'm willing to sacrifice some energy :p

*weeps* :fail:

Well then, get your ass on Newegg and price up a build. Then we can help further. But for god's sake, don't look at any of the laptop parts in case u decide to switch again...

I suggest starting with:
Q6600, E8400, E4500, E2160
IP35-E, IP35-PRO
250-320 GB Seagate, WD, or Samsung
2 GB DDR2 800 MHz Gskill, Corsair, OCZ, Crucial
Antec P182
HX620
8000GT, HD3850 512 MB

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 13th, 2008, 10:17 PM
Yeah, I just got the February PC Gamer from my school's library, and it has a bunch of good deals in it. So tomorrow maybe I'll look up some parts.

343guiltymc
February 13th, 2008, 10:24 PM
Yeah, I just got the February PC Gamer from my school's library, and it has a bunch of good deals in it. So tomorrow maybe I'll look up some parts.
The February is old, the ad's prices are probably changed by now.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 16th, 2008, 07:18 PM
Ok, I got some time last night at my friend's house while he played CoD4 on his 360 (dumb noob) to pick out some parts. Here's what I've got:

I can has Cooler Master Cosmos plz? (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119138)

Mobo (couldn't use the one in PC Gamer cuz it didn't have PCIe 2.0) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128080)

RAM (GREAT deal, DDR2 800, at 45 DOLLARS) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231098)

CPU-2.4GHz Quad (teh one from PC Gamer) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115017)

320GB 7200RPM HD (no way I'm paying for a 10k RPM one. Overrated) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148140)

And, of course, Vista Home Premium System Builder version (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116202)


Now, I need to make a decision about the video card. I was planning on getting an 8800GT, but then I remembered ATI's 3000 series was out, and they had faster speeds and if I got one, I could save a lot of money. So is it worth it to blow a crapload of money on an 8800GT (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130318), or save a lot of money and get a MUCH faster (DDR4 memory; 320 stream processors anyone?) Radeon HD 3870 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102719)?

It seems like a no-brainer, but is there something I missed?

Off-topic: I'm almost done Portal. 1337 game.

343guiltymc
February 16th, 2008, 10:30 PM
Well the 2900 XTX had GDDR 4 memory, and it couldn't even beat 8800 GT in any game. Besidesthe 3870 is only 20 bucks cheaper. 3870 is better than 8800 GT in using two card config however.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 17th, 2008, 08:59 AM
2900XTX? But this is a lot later, the 3870, completely new, and probably a lot of improvement over that one. Plus, in the future I'll almost definitely be upgrading to a dual-card setup, so if its crossfire setup is better than the 8800's SLI setup, I'd definitely go for the 3870 if it meant having a little less power than the 8800GT for a year or two. The 3870 has got to be better than the 8800GT though, I mean, better memory, more stream processors, all that fancy stuff, what would make it not as good?

ImSpartacus
February 17th, 2008, 09:50 AM
2900XTX? But this is a lot later, the 3870, completely new, and probably a lot of improvement over that one. Plus, in the future I'll almost definitely be upgrading to a dual-card setup, so if its crossfire setup is better than the 8800's SLI setup, I'd definitely go for the 3870 if it meant having a little less power than the 8800GT for a year or two. The 3870 has got to be better than the 8800GT though, I mean, better memory, more stream processors, all that fancy stuff, what would make it not as good?

What I like about the 8800gt is it's a single slot. The prices have also lowered considerably. I've seen plenty nearing the 200$ mark.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150273

This is 219$ after rebate. It's also a good brand and slightly overclocked.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127329

This is the absolute cheapest at 209$, but its a dual slot b/c it has upgraded cooling. It's also a brand I'm not fimilar with.

The 3870 on the other hand...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125086

Same price, and then you get 6.60 in shipping vs 5.58 in the 209$ 8800gt and 6.33 in the 219$ 8800gt.

I was going to get a 512mb 3850 myself, but then I saw the crumpling prices of the 8800gt's and I'm sold.

Amit
February 17th, 2008, 12:32 PM
What I like about the 8800gt is it's a single slot. The prices have also lowered considerably. I've seen plenty nearing the 200$ mark.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150273

This is 219$ after rebate. It's also a good brand and slightly overclocked.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127329

This is the absolute cheapest at 209$, but its a dual slot b/c it has upgraded cooling. It's also a brand I'm not fimilar with.

The 3870 on the other hand...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125086

Same price, and then you get 6.60 in shipping vs 5.58 in the 209$ 8800gt and 6.33 in the 219$ 8800gt.

I was going to get a 512mb 3850 myself, but then I saw the crumpling prices of the 8800gt's and I'm sold.

I'm running 2 of the fastest HD 3870s available in CrossFireX mode and they're both single slot coolers and I got them both for a cheaper price than most 8800GTs in my area.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 17th, 2008, 03:31 PM
Yeah, I don't care a whole lot about a difference of $20 or so. I want to know which is better-the 3870 I posted, or the best 8800GT that ImSpartucus posted? The specs look overwhelming; GDDR4 memory, higher clock speed, 320 stream processors, etc etc etc. I'm just saying, is there something I missed? Is there some number that Newegg doesn't show that automatically makes the 8800GT better than the 3870?

343guiltymc
February 17th, 2008, 09:09 PM
Yeah, I don't care a whole lot about a difference of $20 or so. I want to know which is better-the 3870 I posted, or the best 8800GT that ImSpartucus posted? The specs look overwhelming; GDDR4 memory, higher clock speed, 320 stream processors, etc etc etc. I'm just saying, is there something I missed? Is there some number that Newegg doesn't show that automatically makes the 8800GT better than the 3870?
Specs are one thing, benchmarks are another.
http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics_2007.html?modelx=33&model1=1057&model2=1060&chart=318

Amit
February 18th, 2008, 12:33 PM
Check out the following pages for specific game Benchmarks of the Sapphire Atomic HD 3870, ATI HD3870, ATI 3850, and Palit 8800GT:

Crysis (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/sapphire_atomic_hd3780/7.htm)
Knights of the Sea (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/sapphire_atomic_hd3780/8.htm)
Bioshock (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/sapphire_atomic_hd3780/9.htm)
Call of Duty 4 (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/sapphire_atomic_hd3780/10.htm)
World in Conflict(very high, play it on high or medium for better FPS) (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/sapphire_atomic_hd3780/11.htm)
Call of Juarez (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/sapphire_atomic_hd3780/12.htm)
3DMark 06 Professional (http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/sapphire_atomic_hd3780/13.htm)

With all of these cards you will get comparable performance to each other and most of the time it's a quite large jump above actual playable performance(25-30FPS). Even though the 8800GT seems to be the best choice for gaming, you're not really going to notice much of a visible difference when playing games besides the ATI cards being proven to have slightly better image quality while sacrificing a little performance. The reason I chose the ATi cards over the nVidia cards is because all next generation ATi video cards have HDMI output to your HDTV or HDMI capable monitor such as mine. So if you want to have high definition gaming on an HDTV, as well as HD video, then get the ATi cards, specifically the ATi Radeon HD 3870.

Warsaw
February 18th, 2008, 07:26 PM
It might also help to know that both the 8800GT and the HD3870 come in single-slot variants, with the HD3870 single-slot actually remaining better cooled than the dual-slot design.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 18th, 2008, 09:04 PM
Hm, it seems like on all the games except for CoD4, the Sapphire 3870 has around the same or a little higher benchmarks than the 8800GT.

SuperSunny
February 19th, 2008, 12:05 AM
I seriously thought that the image quality fact was simply back in the 5000 series days of Nvidia. From what I've noticed they've fixed that up.

Warsaw
February 19th, 2008, 03:42 PM
I would recommend forgoing the 3870 and getting an HD3870 X2. It's slightly better than two 3870s in Crossfire mode, and is actually slightly more powerful than a GeForce 8800 Ultra.

Review on Tom's Hardware:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/01/28/ati_r680_the_rage_fury_maxx_2/index.html

Xetsuei
February 19th, 2008, 06:51 PM
I would recommend forgoing the 3870 and getting an HD3870 X2. It's slightly better than two 3870s in Crossfire mode, and is actually slightly more powerful than a GeForce 8800 Ultra.

Review on Tom's Hardware:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/01/28/ati_r680_the_rage_fury_maxx_2/index.html

Yeah, the 3870x2 is the most powerful card out right now, and it's only $450. You really can't beat that, seeing as nvidia's best card is nearly $250 more, and doesn't perform as well.

Amit
February 19th, 2008, 08:39 PM
Xetsuei™;223758']Yeah, the 3870x2 is the most powerful card out right now, and it's only $450. You really can't beat that, seeing as nvidia's best card is nearly $250 more, and doesn't perform as well.

Truu dat. I was actually reading HotHardware's review today and found out that it really is the fastest card out there for $250 cheaper than it's nearest competitor. But still, as the reviewer said, all it takes is for nVidia to slap 2 8800GTXs or Ultras together and instant performance increase.

Xetsuei
February 19th, 2008, 09:37 PM
Truu dat. I was actually reading HotHardware's review today and found out that it really is the fastest card out there for $250 cheaper than it's nearest competitor. But still, as the reviewer said, all it takes is for nVidia to slap 2 8800GTXs or Ultras together and instant performance increase.

Yeah, but hardly anyone would buy them because they would cost nearly $1200-$1400. My main point is they (3780x2s) preform better than a $700 card while costing $250 less.

Warsaw
February 19th, 2008, 10:01 PM
Also, you could slap two HD3870 X2s together in Crossfire (as soon as they get the drivers out), and retake the top spot from nVidia.

Looks like ATI has finally released a winner, even if it is almost too late for this generation of cards.

Amit
February 20th, 2008, 01:35 AM
Also, you could slap two HD3870 X2s together in Crossfire (as soon as they get the drivers out), and retake the top spot from nVidia.

Looks like ATI has finally released a winner, even if it is almost too late for this generation of cards.

Hellz yeah, my heart actually leaped a bit when i read that part of the review.

Warsaw
February 20th, 2008, 03:51 PM
Personally, I am glad to see nVidia starting to crumble. Despite the fact that I've had more nVidia cards than ATI cards, I just don't like nVidia. I've had issues with my nVidia cards, but my ATI ones have always run just fine.

343guiltymc
February 20th, 2008, 04:06 PM
Personally, I am glad to see nVidia starting to crumble. Despite the fact that I've had more nVidia cards than ATI cards, I just don't like nVidia. I've had issues with my nVidia cards, but my ATI ones have always run just fine.
It's good that Nvidia has the competition, because if they don't they'll just charge a outrageous amount of money for video cards.

Amit
February 20th, 2008, 04:13 PM
It's good that Nvidia has the competition, because if they don't they'll just charge a outrageous amount of money for video cards.

Their prices are already ridiculously high priced and it doesn't help that retailers jack the price $30-$50 above the MSRP value.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 20th, 2008, 05:03 PM
I would recommend forgoing the 3870 and getting an HD3870 X2. It's slightly better than two 3870s in Crossfire mode, and is actually slightly more powerful than a GeForce 8800 Ultra.

Review on Tom's Hardware:
http://www.tomshardware.com/2008/01/28/ati_r680_the_rage_fury_maxx_2/index.html
Wow, thanks for telling me about that, because holy SHIT, tell me this isn't a good deal (http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Gamer_Ultra_CrossFire_9000/)! 2.2GHz Quad-core AMD Phenom proc, the Cooler Master Cosmos case mod with a side window that I've had my eye on, and the 3870X2, all for about $1300. That's beast! I'd better start making money, that's my new computer. Even though none of you like cyberpower and all that, but idc, this is a fucking sweet deal.

343guiltymc
February 20th, 2008, 05:14 PM
Not really, considering the thing doesn't even come with a monitor and it comes with a Athlon X2 6000, which is cheaper and a lot worse than Intel's lineup. Hardly anything "holy shit!" considering Cyberpower and IBUYPOWER always offer their products cheaper than everybody else. So you are saying that you don't care that you are wasting 1300 dollars are a PC that may or may not die on you as soon as you get it and the customer service does nothing to fix it? You're better off building you're own PC.

Amit
February 20th, 2008, 05:28 PM
Yeah, you can hardly call anything a deal for $1300 that comes with a pretty crap CPU.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 20th, 2008, 05:57 PM
I'm saying if you choose the Phenom option. It's AMD's quad-cores, and it's even cheaper than Intel's. And I read something in PC Gamer about how AMD will actually put all 4 cores on the same CPU, instead of Intel which supposedly puts two dual-cores together and sells it as quad. Plus, even if you built your own pc, there's no customer service there either. And I see what you're saying, you would be in a tough spot if it randomly DOA'd on you, but that's unlikely if you chose compatible parts. I'm going to see how much it would cost to build a pc with the same parts as that and determine whether or not it's still around the $1400 it would cost from cyberpower.

343guiltymc
February 20th, 2008, 07:01 PM
I'm saying if you choose the Phenom option. It's AMD's quad-cores, and it's even cheaper than Intel's. And I read something in PC Gamer about how AMD will actually put all 4 cores on the same CPU, instead of Intel which supposedly puts two dual-cores together and sells it as quad. Plus, even if you built your own pc, there's no customer service there either. And I see what you're saying, you would be in a tough spot if it randomly DOA'd on you, but that's unlikely if you chose compatible parts. I'm going to see how much it would cost to build a pc with the same parts as that and determine whether or not it's still around the $1400 it would cost from cyberpower.
Just goes to show that just because something looks good on paper, doesn't mean it works in practice. In the the latest issue of PC Gamer they say that the Phenom gives disappointing benchmarks even compared to Intel's cheapest quad cores. Also what do you mean "compatible parts"? If they weren't compatible you wouldn't even be able to put the PC together at all. The problem is that Cyberpower and IBUYPOWER PC's tend to give you tons of problems such as random BSOD and their crap customer service don't help much.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 20th, 2008, 07:12 PM
But why is that? I know that just happens "in practice" even though it should work "on paper", but why is it that PCs from the -power sites just randomly phail? I mean, the components, software, everything, is the same as if you built the thing yourself, so why the hell does that stuff happen with them and not with you (if you built it yourself)?

ImSpartacus
February 20th, 2008, 07:18 PM
Yeah, I don't care a whole lot about a difference of $20 or so. I want to know which is better-the 3870 I posted, or the best 8800GT that ImSpartucus posted? The specs look overwhelming; GDDR4 memory, higher clock speed, 320 stream processors, etc etc etc. I'm just saying, is there something I missed? Is there some number that Newegg doesn't show that automatically makes the 8800GT better than the 3870?

The 8800GT is superior in most cases (the memory only matters in very high resolution).

343guiltymc
February 20th, 2008, 08:58 PM
But why is that? I know that just happens "in practice" even though it should work "on paper", but why is it that PCs from the -power sites just randomly phail? I mean, the components, software, everything, is the same as if you built the thing yourself, so why the hell does that stuff happen with them and not with you (if you built it yourself)?
Meh, considering how relatively cheap they sell the PCs for, how the hell are you suppose to know where they got it from. Besides the PC's are sloppily shoved into trucks under loads full of other heavy shit and have to be shipped across the country........Just saying. And also video memory does matter now with Crysis because it will be faster to load all the huge terrain with high video memory.

Warsaw
February 20th, 2008, 09:34 PM
The 8800GT is superior in most cases (the memory only matters in very high resolution).

But the HD3870 X2 still beats the 8800GT in just about every area. Remember, the 8800GT is technically a "budget" version of the 8800GTS, which is in itself a budget version of the 8800GTX. The 8800Ultra is an anomaly, because it is way out of the price range of most people (so is the 8800GTX, but that's a jacked up price).

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 22nd, 2008, 05:22 PM
I don't think I'm going to get the 3870X2. I won't need that kind of power and it's expensive. I'm just going to get that Sapphire 3870 GDDR4 512MB instead. I totaled up the final costs, and with some modifications of some part choices, it would cost me about $100 less than Cyberpower to build a PC with the same specs. I just want to know one thing, is there any way at all to get the Cooler Master Cosmos case mod (check the box and look at it before you assume I'm talking about the regular Cosmos) on this (http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Gamer_Ultra_CrossFire_9000/) computer? It looks extremely 1337, but it looks like only Cyberpower offers it. Is there any other way to get that case?

343guiltymc
February 22nd, 2008, 05:37 PM
Don't know, just go ahead and buy it, the case is a waste. I would certainly like to see the fireworks when you use it.

4RT1LL3RY
February 22nd, 2008, 06:33 PM
Why not get the new 9600GT, it beats the HD3870 in every benchmark I've seen. Its nothing like the 8600GT either, it has a 256-bit memory interface instead of 128-bit.
They have them in stock at newegg now and
Guru3D (http://www.guru3d.com/article/Videocards/501) has a nice set of benchmarks for them all.

Oh and don't forget that all of those were done with x16 AF and x4 AA

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 22nd, 2008, 08:18 PM
Hm, you're right.

Good job, you changed my mind again. 9600GT ftw.

343guiltymc
February 22nd, 2008, 10:16 PM
Hm, you're right.

Good job, you changed my mind again. 9600GT ftw.
It's still worse than a 8800 GT, which is probably better for you.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 22nd, 2008, 10:32 PM
And the 8800GT costs a lot moar.

Warsaw
February 22nd, 2008, 10:55 PM
Ugly case, TBQH.

Also, you might as well spend that little extra on the GeForce 8800GT. It is worth it.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 23rd, 2008, 09:46 AM
...

Look. If the 8800GT is what I wanted in the first place, and then along came the 3870 which was a little cheaper and almost as good if not as good as the 8800GT, you better believe I'd get it. So I wanted the 3870. Then I find the 9600GT is better than the 3870, which means it's just a hair below the 8800GT in performance, which I can take. And it's much cheaper.

343guiltymc
February 23rd, 2008, 04:04 PM
Ugly case, TBQH.

Also, you might as well spend that little extra on the GeForce 8800GT. It is worth it.
It's just not cosmetics on the case, people have been getting issues with the case. The only one who didn't seems to be Logan Decker, the guy who wrote the the guide that he seems to be following in PC Gamer.

Warsaw
February 23rd, 2008, 04:49 PM
Clean lines and less doodads, FTW. Never fails.

343guiltymc
February 23rd, 2008, 07:01 PM
Clean lines and less doodads, FTW. Never fails.
There isn't much doodads on the case, just overpriced.

0m3g4Muff1n987
February 23rd, 2008, 07:49 PM
Mb I should get the Antec Nine Hundred then. Minus 100 dollars is a cool bonus.

343guiltymc
February 23rd, 2008, 10:52 PM
Mb I should get the Antec Nine Hundred then. Minus 100 dollars is a cool bonus.
You need to do more research. Choosing the right parts is the hardest part to building a PC.

Warsaw
February 24th, 2008, 12:11 AM
There isn't much doodads on the case, just overpriced.

I meant looks-wise, not functionality-wise.

0m3g4Muff1n987
March 5th, 2008, 06:25 PM
Ok. I'm not going to get a 9600GT. They don't outperform 3870's! Now I'm fiercely debating between a Sapphire 3870, an EVGA 8800GT and an MSI 8800GT. The EVGA has slightly lower specs, but the MSI has a great heatsink. But that could be a blessing and a curse-the heatsink could block other slots. And then there's the 3870 which is sitting off to the side. And for the life of me, I can't find benchmarks between brands of 8800GT's so I don't know if the MSI is even worth buying. And will it really take up that much space? Apparently, the heatsink doubles its height.

http://c1.neweggimages.com/NeweggImage/productimage/14-127-329-04.jpg

Oh yeah, and I heard that Crossfire can use hybrid cards, and is it any better than SLI?

Snowy
March 5th, 2008, 09:55 PM
MSI doesn't have the best customer service. Go with EVGA.

Warsaw
March 6th, 2008, 06:00 PM
If you are so concerned about space, pick one of the single-slot 8800GTs...

Also, Crossfire and SLI are not much different performance-wise. The advantage of Crossfire is that you don't need two of the same card. The advantage of SLI is that it is all hardwired into the motherboard (I think...I don't know if cards still require that bridge connector).

0m3g4Muff1n987
March 6th, 2008, 07:04 PM
Hardwired into the mobo? What, so more data can get sent back and forth or something? Does that actually contribute to a performance increase though?

Warsaw
March 6th, 2008, 07:29 PM
Crossfire and SLI are not much different performance-wise.
.

0m3g4Muff1n987
March 6th, 2008, 09:18 PM
I am illiterate. :P

All kidding aside, what is having it directly in the mobo good for?

Warsaw
March 6th, 2008, 09:31 PM
No separate parts to worry about breaking and/or losing. And a closer connection does reduce the data travel time, though it won't be noticeable to your eye.