tag size limit

[Rob Oplawar]

"tags are 0.71M too large for structure bsps (10.19M+13.52M>23.00M)"

I'm getting tired of reducing my bsp to get it to work with my tags.



WAVE OF LAG (10:30:19 PM): add another bsp?
WAVE OF LAG (10:30:43 PM): a fake bsp
roboplawar (10:30:50 PM): what do you mean fake?
WAVE OF LAG (10:31:04 PM): i mean a fake bsp so that you can open up the tag limit
WAVE OF LAG (10:31:08 PM): CMT did it years ago, man
...
roboplawar (10:31:32 PM): idgi
roboplawar (10:31:35 PM): what do you mean?
WAVE OF LAG (10:31:45 PM): i mean
WAVE OF LAG (10:31:47 PM): add
WAVE OF LAG (10:31:48 PM): another
WAVE OF LAG (10:31:49 PM): BSP
roboplawar (10:31:52 PM): um
roboplawar (10:31:53 PM): i already have
roboplawar (10:31:54 PM): like
roboplawar (10:31:55 PM): 7
WAVE OF LAG (10:32:10 PM): SO?
roboplawar (10:32:13 PM): and a couple of them are really small
roboplawar (10:32:24 PM): so what good is adding another bsp gonna do me?
...
roboplawar (10:33:26 PM): i want to know just how exactly adding a "fake bsp" will somehow magically avoid this tag limit
WAVE OF LAG (10:33:35 PM): i dunnno, i forgot


wtf is he talking about? Anybody know if there's any way around the evil tag size limit aside from hax? I'm trying not to split this BSP into two because there's no real clean place to do it, and the switch might be rough- I'd have to teleport your squad of marines in potential view of the player.

[Masterz1337]

This is a tricky one. Basicly, theres a certain amount of memory the game engine can use. The BSP takes up some of it, and the tags the rest. The problem is that the size of your tags is taking up to much memory when a BSP is loaded. I suggest you look at any custom colision models, and use the lowest LOD to make the collision. If you are making a MP map, simply make your textures lower res. Also, music takes up a large chunk of tagspace as well. If you need any help, PM me your contact info.

[Bad Waffle]

rob forgot to post an integral part of the message


roboplawar (9:34:29 PM): h2v can suck my balls
roboplawar (9:34:35 PM): and you can quote me on that
WAVE OF LAG (9:34:38 PM): then you can suck mine too
roboplawar (9:34:41 PM): kk
roboplawar (9:34:44 PM): =O
WAVE OF LAG (9:34:44 PM): and you wont like that
WAVE OF LAG (9:34:49 PM): SALTY
WAVE OF LAG (9:34:51 PM): HAIRY
WAVE OF LAG (9:35:02 PM): AND TOO BIG FOR A NORMAL WOMAN



also, i am drun

[CrAsHOvErRide]

I don't know if it's really a problem or a precaution/limitation made up by tool. If so, there would be a way of bypassing it...with reverse engineering though. :/

[Choking Victim]

tool_pro bypasses the tag size limit, but it can only be used if your map only has 1 bsp. If your map has two bsps and you used tool_pro to compile it, then the game will crash upon switching bsp's.

[Bad Waffle]

*cough*

err..the map has 7 bsps. I dont think rob wants to split the series into 26+ maps.

[Choking Victim]

ohh wow, didn't think it was that large.

[Bad Waffle]

well its going to be 'episodal', really, and each of those has a lot of BSP's.

if only we could compile new .bitmaps.map and new .sounds.map

[Masterz1337]

That wouldn't make any difference Wave. The tags in those maps would be loaded into memory no differently than if they were part of the actual map.

[Kornman00]

Actually it would make a difference, but not the kind he needs. The memory used for the resource data of bitmap and sounds don't go into the tag memory. It would be nice if h1 was more like h2 and stored the animation data external to the tag data, but h1 only does that with bitmaps, sounds and render geometry.

Want to cut down on your tag data? If it's just strictly a MP map then delete some of the AI related tag blocks in the globals tag. IIRC, tool won't complain when building the mp map. Analyze which tags are being included in the build, you may have a tag that you thought you removed from usage but is still creeping in (especially bad for objects since they include shit like collision and shaders etc)

[Rob Oplawar]

I was afraid of that. Well, I've discovered a way to split it up into two BSPs cleanly, so I'm going to do that. I've already done that on some other BSPs as well, so it's becoming basically one BSP per combat arena. It works, but it makes the gameplay even more linear than before, in that in most cases it forbids backtracking. But I would rather sacrifice backtracking (which with garbage collection isn't very useful anyway) than the level of detail I'm using on the BSPs. Ty for your help, and now:

Up, up and away!
*disappears into the ether, leaving no indication of plans to return*

P.S. That "H2V can suck my balls" is entirely out of context. <3 yous guys.

[Sever]

I'm still keeping it in my sig! Keep at it!

[Masterz1337]

There are better ways to do this than split it into separate BSPs.