itt: sel begins unwrapping cliffs, makes shitty map better

[Malloy]

Well I was being serious... I just made a quick shoop to explain better.

http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/3802/selcrappymapcritlol.jpg

oh and overall there is a distinctive hue of purple, but if that was what you're goinf or then thats cool.

[Sel]

The yellow is really the only valid point I see there. The geometry of those parts is pretty boxy, and may or may not get changed, depending on how much halo's clipping issues mess things up.

Now, there are a total of 3 final(hopefully) textures that are seen on the structure. The strips, and the red/blue generator.

The other textures are all stock, or placeholders and obviously are not going to fit with the other ones.

[Malloy]

Oh well thats groovey then, just dont sort of over tile shit because it tends to look monotonous on the eyes otherwise cool beans.

[Sel]

Yes, the tiling is quite an issue, unfortunately there aren't any good halo placeholders that don't have borders :\

[Cagerrin]

What're those circles below the bridge supposed to be? They look rather incongruous.

[Sel]

What're those circles below the bridge supposed to be? They look rather incongruous.

idk

mass modeled it ! :saddowns:

[Cagerrin]

well it sucks

make him fix it :maddowns:

Being serious now, an open-air energy beam? Emitters like a horizontal version of this (http://www.majhost.com/gallery/TalonX/randomstuff/Inspiration/Terrain-Buildings/be52e8c6fa37098d5a0acc7392398943.jpg) or something similar.

[Sel]

I've been considering that, but couldn't come up with a worthwhile way of implementing it.

I'll worry about the nicer stuff like that later, once were in the lets make things look great phase, but right now I'd rather not worry about it :saddowns:

[Mass]

I got lazy, but they actually look pretty good to me in that picture.
I was thinking there would be some sort of visible energy transfer between those two pads, perhaps with a kill-box to accompany it.

Yeah, I made that whole area with aesthetics as an after-thought, and it's pretty obvious.

[Sever]

Heh, they look kinda like speakers. Do something like Yoyorast Island's central tower, with a localized audio track playing there.

[FluffyDucky™]

Rofl, we can have raves thar!

[Rentafence]

Yes, the tiling is quite an issue, unfortunately there aren't any good halo placeholders that don't have borders :\

Or you could just have it repeat less, ffs.

[Heathen]

Have something on the center of both those two circles emit a small ball of light like a plasma pistol charge and have an ominous buzzing when in between them. Like the noise fluorescent lights make.

[rossmum]

I still hate the architecture of the britdge. It just doesn't strike me as Forerunner, I can't really explain why... but it could be a lot better than it is now.

[n00b1n8R]

Heh, they look kinda like speakers. Do something like Yoyorast Island's central tower, with a localized audio track playing there.
Don't even joke about that.

[rossmum]

Heh, they look kinda like speakers. Do something like Yoyorast Island's central tower, with a localized audio track playing there.
Yes! And put a fuel rod gun there!

[SnaFuBAR]

put two up there

make them dual wieldable!

[FluffyDucky™]

O M G YES DO IT! NOWWWWWW. ALL YOUR LIVES ARE BELONG TO MAH FUELS!

[neuro]

to get rid of tiling, you can use a ground-shader basically.

since that shader supports a colourmap, you can add colourvariation to the thing (and even add like grime and stuff to where the thing intersects with the ground.)

you'll need to rework the UVmapping for that though. and keep in mind that it'll give you a bit of a performance-hit.

[FluffyDucky™]

Oh Selenticccccccccccc, I made something in Max for youuuuuuuuuuuu :embarrassed: Get on xfire asap Mr! :)

[Sel]

to get rid of tiling, you can use a ground-shader basically.

since that shader supports a colourmap, you can add colourvariation to the thing (and even add like grime and stuff to where the thing intersects with the ground.)

you'll need to rework the UVmapping for that though. and keep in mind that it'll give you a bit of a performance-hit.

I'm not horribly worried about performance issues in halo from this, I'll look into giving it a go.


Oh Selenticccccccccccc, I made something in Max for youuuuuuuuuuuu :embarrassed: Get on xfire asap Mr! :)

I'll see what I can do, if you can upload it somewhere and PM it to me that'd be really helpful since I can't get my laptop connect anywhere.

PS: Con, upload the door stuff so I can do that !

[malolo420]

I think I remember

[Con]

PS: Con, upload the door stuff so I can do that !
its already uploaded dumbass!

[Sel]

I think I remember

Whoaaa, where have you been?


its already uploaded dumbass!

Oh! Ok!

So, I got a hold of the files, and messed around with the tags, and here's what I've got.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/revdoor.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/revdoor2.jpg

The coloured parts reflect the status (locked, unlocked) of the door. I originally wanted something similar to the h2 arbiter doors, where the parts change to blue, and then the door opens, but I can't seem to get that going with this, but I'm quite happy to settle for having these two colours flash.

Suggestions/crit?

[BobtheGreatII]

I don't really have any suggestions. But that looks great.

[Sel]

I'm going to keep messing around with the tags, hopefully con can get on redoing the other textures so that it fits in better :p

[Higuy]

Looks pretty good, I just hope it blends in with the rest of the forerunner textures.

[malolo420]

Edit: Oops I think this post is considered spam sorry everyone, don't really remember forum rules anymore. Well is this map the same one from before?

I've been living on my own, just moved into this nice house with my buddys. And I've been learning a lot about life secrets of the universe with the help of some trips, made a lot of mistakes like getting addicted to shooting heroin. In rehab, well a home detox program.
Got this preppy chick for a girl friend that doesn't understand me and I just want to leave her but she might be pregnant and I dunno I just want a hippy or a punk chick. Although there is a couple preppy chicks that I like but I've only talked to and seen one twice and just met this other one who I see around every once in a while the other day.

But yeah, I'm back. Came to finish overdose and make a bunch of other maps, help out the ol' team to I guess. Just gotta haul my comp over from my parents house to mine, I'm just using this really bad laptop right now, 5gb hard drive, and 128mb of ram, don't even know the graphics card. The OS takes up over half the space, then since it doesn't have any memory it uses up almost the rest of the hard drive with virtual memory so it doesn't even have a gig left. Anyways I'll take to you later on xfire, I'll be on more once I get my comp here. Thanks for listening to my little rant who ever read that,
I just needed to release it.

[Masterz1337]

Whoaaa, where have you been?



Oh! Ok!

So, I got a hold of the files, and messed around with the tags, and here's what I've got.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/revdoor.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/revdoor2.jpg

The coloured parts reflect the status (locked, unlocked) of the door. I originally wanted something similar to the h2 arbiter doors, where the parts change to blue, and then the door opens, but I can't seem to get that going with this, but I'm quite happy to settle for having these two colours flash.

Suggestions/crit?
I'm greedy and want them.

[Lateksi]

A green colour would be better for open status but I think you know better which colours suit them.

[Siliconmaster]

I'm greedy and want them.

I don't blame you. Those are very nice looking.

[Sel]

I'm greedy and want them.

If con has no issues with it, I'm fine with handing them over to you once I finish everything up on them.


A green colour would be better for open status but I think you know better which colours suit them.

When I first set them to reflect the locked/unlocked status they chose green, but I thought the colours looked kinda out of place, and went with the forerunner blue instead. If people want to see it do green though I can post those so you can all compare.

PS : Cool to see that your back malolo.

[Rentafence]

Red closed
Blink green twice with some cool sound
Goto Blue
Open

Everyone is happy

[Sel]

Tell me how to do that, and I'll look into it!

[Rentafence]

Uh. Shit. Clever use of hiding lens flares inside the door during the animation? Haha I have no idea.

[Sel]

Uh. Shit. Clever use of hiding lens flares inside the door during the animation? Haha I have no idea.

Well, that's a problem now isn't it!

[Rentafence]

No. Not really, not for me.

[Con]

Red closed
Blink green twice with some cool sound
Goto Blue
Open

Everyone is happy
Don't forget, we have locked doors too. I would suggest red for locked, and an unlocked closed door should be blue or something, green on opening.

[Sel]

Don't forget, we have locked doors too. I would suggest red for locked, and an unlocked closed door should be blue or something, green on opening.

I've been messing with the tag, but after several hours of fuck all else to do, I wasn't able to find any way to include more than two colours heh.

[p0lar_bear]

Look at the doors used in T&R/Keyes. They turn white and flash when they open.

[Masterz1337]

I can take a crack at it if you wish.

Edit: Connor told me to ask you if it was ok for the doors, and you're telling me it's ok if he says ok, so I'm guessing it's ok :p.

[Sel]

Look at the doors used in T&R/Keyes. They turn white and flash when they open.

I'm almost entirely sure that's a dynamic light, and not something related to this, but I'll look and see if I can figure something out.


I can take a crack at it if you wish.

Edit: Connor told me to ask you if it was ok for the doors, and you're telling me it's ok if he says ok, so I'm guessing it's ok :p.

Well, I'll see what I can do to get the files to you while I'm out here, but my internet access is intermittent at best, so we'll see what happens :p

[Sel]

I've been touching up the glass shader a bit to be a little more visible, and such.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/revdoorglass.jpg

I also started working on a teleporter room to stick on the outskirt teleporters, I was going to use jcap's concept which he gave to me way back, but decided I wanted something a little bit more grandiose. I still tried to use some elements from the old concept, and still hope to use some with other additions (namely the pillars). However I lost that file when the windows 7 beta expired, so I haven't exactly got anything to go on.

Anyway,

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/Tele1.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/Tele2.jpg

Obviously, the bottom floor is very bland and empty, but I'll be adding a lot more there so don't tell me about it, I'm open to suggestions as to what to throw down there to spice it up though.

On an unrelated note, the double sided faces feature in Max 2009, does anyone know how to disable it?

It's making things fucking hard to work with :/

[Disaster]

Umm, I think you have to right click on the object and choose backface cull.

[Higuy]

Umm, I think you have to right click on the object and choose backface cull.
Yes.
Right click, properties, check backface cull.

[SnaFuBAR]

green for open is a terrible idea. let's not associate this shit with traffic lights.

[Rentafence]

green for open is a terrible idea. let's not associate this shit with traffic lights.

Why not?

[p0lar_bear]

In Cali, getting nailed at street lights is a common occurrence. I'm pretty sure Snaf doesn't want to be dying repeatedly in front of something that reminds him of a street light. :v:

[n00b1n8R]

green for open is a terrible idea. let's not associate this shit with traffic lights.
Why not? It's a symbol everybody recognises and it's not like Green/Red is used in hundreds of other places to indicate go/stop.

[Con]

There's nothing wrong with red/green. Making it different just for the sake of being different is not only overthinking it but unintuitive.

[Sel]

The only issue I have with the red/green is that it doesn't look nearly as nice as the blue for the glowing parts.

For that reason I had to change the lense flares to match that colour because they didn't look right in green with the blue glow :X


Either way, as jcap has reminded me several times, blue is the generic forerunner colour for active, so I figure I'll end up sticking with the choice of colours we have now.

[stankpot]

whens the beta dood

[Masterz1337]

The only issue I have with the red/green is that it doesn't look nearly as nice as the blue for the glowing parts.

For that reason I had to change the lense flares to match that colour because they didn't look right in green with the blue glow :X


Either way, as jcap has reminded me several times, blue is the generic forerunner colour for active, so I figure I'll end up sticking with the choice of colours we have now.
Actually, the H1 doors always used green for active, but blue fits in way better with forerunner environments and styles.

[Sel]

Actually, the H1 doors always used green for active, but blue fits in way better with forerunner environments and styles.

I know, these use the same device_machine tag too, with slight alterations :p

Also I can send you the doors now that I'm back home (once I get them moved to my desktop)

[Sel]

Hey boys, we're almost there!

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev7.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev8.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev9.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev10.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev11.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev12.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev13.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev14.jpg

Ground texture and shader need a little bit of tweaking, but the cliffs should be set to go.

Only a bit more to go until this sees a release, teh lag finish the waterfall~

(Ignore the scenery rocks ie: any of them that are still gray.)

[Sel]

ome progression pictures as well.

Oldest

http://screenshot.xfire.com/screenshot/natural/0cb33928375582fd28ee0bb42c1330597fbe9003.png

Old

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/rev5.jpg

New

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/rev7.jpg

[Hunter]

I prefer the 1st image in the progression images. The newest looks too gloomy. Grass and shit is nicer than sand imo. And I like the sun :)

[Higuy]

finally
lookin' good just fix the waterfall
then its beta time again :neckbeard:
also, is there a new part of the bsp I see?

[Ganon]

looks good selentic, I would like to beta :3 ok thnx

[il Duce Primo]

Everything looks really bland. Everything is a tanish color. You have a tiling texture on most of the structure. Atleast uv it better. The only thing I'm really loving is the sky. The design of the map doesn't seem to have any flow, things are just here and there.

[Rentafence]

I agree with Duce.

[Sel]

Everything looks really bland.


How so?



Everything is a tanish color.


Well, it is a desert...?



You have a tiling texture on most of the structure. Atleast uv it better.


We're also short a lot of textures, and working with placeholders.



The only thing I'm really loving is the sky. The design of the map doesn't seem to have any flow, things are just here and there.

I appreciate the criticism and all, but I'm not quite sure I get where you're going with this.

[il Duce Primo]

You picked to use a desert as your environment. Just because it's a desert doesn't mean it should be passed off automaticly as ok to be boring. Everything is very monotone, so add some more colors to it. Maybe place some little shrubs here and there. Or just get even more creative. The map design is very poor. You have all these areas on the map that a player would never be interested in going to. Almost as if there was little thought to it. I'm sure you did put a good amount of thought into it, but all those areas a player would rarely go and doesn't change anything in a gameplay sense. You mine as well just take out those areas. I'm trying to make the map overall better and that's where I'm going.

[Ki11a_FTW]

make some cactus scenery :)

E: 2048 post, high rez dimensions

[Inferno]

It'll be like yelling at a cactus.

[jcap]

Should be smaller and have more detail....I've been saying this from the start.

You either have it large and bland, or you make it smaller and put more emphasis on awesome things. You'll push the engine to its limits either way with its poly limits, but one will look crappy, and the other will be beautiful.

[Ki11a_FTW]

Heres a few images from Halo 3's The Ark. Maybe these will give you some ideas

http://www.sabre-squadron.com/images/Halo3/Halo3_Sabre_Sniper.jpg

http://www.ascendantjustice.com/files/beholden/sandbox04_small.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2307/1719991726_3fd68663ed.jpg?v=0


http://www.ascendantjustice.com/files/cocop/The%20Ark/The%20Ark%20Large/DawnBase-large.jpg

:)

[Ganon]

It seems like its way too large, but thats beyond obvious. Some epic rocks and trees should help set the scene quite well

[BobtheGreatII]

Yes! Giant ship/crashed pelicans! They will solve all your problems!

[Advancebo]

For one thing, thats Halo 3, and not Halo CE.

[Ki11a_FTW]

And? The map has a good environment, and im pretty sure selentic is aiming for something similar.
Oh yeah selentic, if you want a better sand detail map just hit me up on xfire :)

[Sel]

Should be smaller and have more detail....I've been saying this from the start.

You either have it large and bland, or you make it smaller and put more emphasis on awesome things. You'll push the engine to its limits either way with its poly limits, but one will look crappy, and the other will be beautiful.

I see your point, and you're right, but both me and mass like the size, and epic driving opportunities so that won't be changing.

If halo 3 pc comes along, then I'll work more on it, and add all sorts of detail, but until then it's going to sit here as another ce map, with a nice sky, sound gameplay, and still a huge jump on most of what gets released nowadays.


You picked to use a desert as your environment. Just because it's a desert doesn't mean it should be passed off automaticly as ok to be boring. Everything is very monotone, so add some more colors to it. Maybe place some little shrubs here and there. Or just get even more creative. The map design is very poor. You have all these areas on the map that a player would never be interested in going to. Almost as if there was little thought to it. I'm sure you did put a good amount of thought into it, but all those areas a player would rarely go and doesn't change anything in a gameplay sense. You mine as well just take out those areas. I'm trying to make the map overall better and that's where I'm going.

I'd like to talk to you on xfire later so I can get your input on some of this stuff. I know the map is lacking in colours and such, and I hope to change that with lights, textures etc, but those are later on down the road.

[Neuro Guro]

I recommend fixing the cliff/ground's bland nature by going through and making a more detailed UV skinning of it. Like, paint all sorts of crevices that will be unique to that certain area, and then dual detail the cliffs. That sort of thing takes some more time and patience, but it has some nice effects when done right. Go look at H2CE's Zanzibar's cliffs to see what I mean.

I did that in Immure 2. I thought it looked cool.

[Sel]

I recommend fixing the cliff/ground's bland nature by going through and making a more detailed UV skinning of it. Like, paint all sorts of crevices that will be unique to that certain area, and then dual detail the cliffs. That sort of thing takes some more time and patience, but it has some nice effects when done right. Go look at H2CE's Zanzibar's cliffs to see what I mean.

I did that in Immure 2. I thought it looked cool.

I wanted to do that, but con didn't want to :(!

(and I can't use photoshop at all lol)

I'll try to convince him more though :p


Also, I've got killa makin some dead trees.

[jcap]

There's too many problems with this map, so I'd like to offer a solution that would hopefully meet in the middle and solve A TON of problems, both gameplay-wise and aesthetically.

http://jcap.h2vista.net/files/halo/whatiwoulddo.jpg

In general, "wrap around" path would be shortened a little. To illustrate this, I shrunk HALF (bottom half) of the picture's height in Photoshop. This by itself did a great job at connecting the vehicle path with the walking one.

The next thing I did is decide to put the vehicle path underground, and completely REMOVE THE BRIDGE. The bridge really looks like SHIT, and there really isn't any way to fit it in well. So, by putting it underground, you can instead have SUPPORT RAFTERS LIKE IN HALO 3 (http://www.bungie.net/Online/Halo3UserContentDetails.aspx?h3fileid=17798331) (black lines on drawing) that can be used instead of a bridge. Maybe a hole in the ceiling of the underground vehicle path would be cool too so you can let some light in. (I REALLY WANT TO EMPHASIZE THE FACT THAT THIS IS AN UNFINISHED RING!)

The middle of the map would be very much like the forerunner hallways you see in Assault on the Control Room (and here in Halo 3) (http://www.bungie.net/Online/Halo3UserContentDetails.aspx?h3fileid=28335649). They're tall and have a lot of open space on the side of them for cover and passing by. The hallways would flow into a center area that would contain a PULSE GENERATOR which you can fight around. The structures in the room will provide the cover we're all familiar with in campaign, so it would be just fine. You would also have the option of going left, right, or directly through the center of the room to get to the other side of the tunnels.

(btw, the hallways would be the extra-wide hallways that have the offshoot to the side of them, like the hallway before you get to Johnson's Warthog at the end of Halo 3. (indicated in dark blue))

The center room would also be unfinished, though, almost like in Halo 3 with the terminal room. It would have a hole in the wall which would flow into the vehicle path. More specifically, it would allow a player to walk directly on to the support rafters I was talking about earlier (that's how you would get up to them). You could also drop down to the vehicle path if you want to from there.

If you do this, you will absolutely have an awesome map. It would be almost perfect, and you wouldn't need that STUPID door syncing and teleporter shit.

[Sever]

I believe this is one of the best posts I've seen by Jcap. I fully agree with every point he made in his proposed solution. Not only does it fix the gameplay issues, but it also fixes any architectural qualms one might have had with the map. Using the standard AotCR Pulse Generator room is a great idea, even though it may not be that original. Using one that is under construction, however, allows you to put in very original detailing on a well-known area without directly copying it, and without favoring gameplay over visuals. The hallways and tunnel idea are both in the same vein, and both should definitely work.

Well played, good sir, well played.

[Sel]

In general, "wrap around" path would be shortened by about half. To illustrate this, I shrunk HALF (bottom half) of the picture's height in Photoshop. This by itself did a great job at connecting the vehicle path with the walking one.

The next thing I did is decide to put the vehicle path underground, and completely REMOVE THE BRIDGE. The bridge really looks like SHIT, and there really isn't any way to fit it in well. So, by putting it underground, you can instead have SUPPORT RAFTERS LIKE IN HALO 3 (http://www.bungie.net/Online/Halo3UserContentDetails.aspx?h3fileid=17798331) (black lines on drawing) that can be used instead of a bridge. Maybe a hole in the ceiling of the underground vehicle path would be cool too so you can let some light in. (I REALLY WANT TO EMPHASIZE THE FACT THAT THIS IS AN UNFINISHED RING!)

The middle of the map would be very much like the forerunner hallways you see in Assault on the Control Room (and here in Halo 3) (http://www.bungie.net/Online/Halo3UserContentDetails.aspx?h3fileid=28335649). They're tall and have a lot of open space on the side of them for cover and passing by. The hallways would flow into a center area that would contain a PULSE GENERATOR which you can fight around. The structures in the room will provide the cover we're all familiar with in campaign, so it would be just fine. You would also have the option of going left, right, or directly through the center of the room to get to the other side of the tunnels.

(btw, the hallways would be the extra-wide hallways that have the offshoot to the side of them, like the hallway before you get to Johnson's Warthog at the end of Halo 3. (indicated in dark blue))

The center room would also be unfinished, though, almost like in Halo 3 with the terminal room. It would have a hole in the wall which would flow into the vehicle path. More specifically, it would allow a player to walk directly on to the support rafters I was talking about earlier (that's how you would get up to them). You could also drop down to the vehicle path if you want to from there.

If you do this, you will absolutely have an awesome map. It would be almost perfect, and you wouldn't need that STUPID door syncing and teleporter shit.

I'm fine with working on doing some of this stuff, if I see a lot of support from other people.

The door based layout we have now would probably stay, because honestly, I really like that idea, and it mixes up regular boring halo gameplay.

I am all for redesigning the hallways, and the middle, and even making the middle underground.

I'm not going to kill off the far sides of the blue terrain.

Those work fine, as the only part of the level that's meant to be a chokepoint is the middle, which should be tweaked quite easily once placed underground.

[jcap]

The sides should really really really really be made more narrow. When you look at other maps, none are as open as that. Making it open gives such less control and makes it SO much more difficult to play on. It's also useless. As one rarely ever uses anything other than the main path, it's better to just cut the map back to what actually matters here and then work on making the main route BETTER.

You're really not losing much of anything by cutting back the sides. The open area is just a waste. When you look at essentially every other Halo map similar in design (icefields, danger canyon, wartorn), they all have more narrow vehicle paths than this.

This all goes back to what I said before. You can have a lot of detail in a smaller space, or a lot of space and no detail. The smaller space and more detail is what people want to see, and it's what makes one map stand out from another.

[Mass]

Sounds fucking good

I'm getting started bre!

[n00b1n8R]

Fucking get onto that shit sel or I'll make another post extolling how DoW is > CoH.

[Sel]

Fucking get onto that shit sel or I'll make another post extolling how DoW is > CoH.

I'm still in debate with jcap about changing the sides, we're both making reasonable arguments, but just about everything else I have no issue with.

[p0lar_bear]

I'm still in debate with jcap about changing the sides, we're both making reasonable arguments, but just about everything else I have no issue with.

The sides are really incredibly useless. You placed a Shade there to defend it or give recon to your team, yet the area is so large, that you need to lead your shots like a motherfucker. And even if a few shots connect, they do jack diddly. Don't forget how the Shade is also placed right in front of a long hallway where someone can just spam you to death if you're not paying attention, which is often because nobody ever takes the footpath.

[Sel]

The sides are really incredibly useless. You placed a Shade there to defend it or give recon to your team, yet the area is so large, that you need to lead your shots like a motherfucker. And even if a few shots connect, they do jack diddly. Don't forget how the Shade is also placed right in front of a long hallway where someone can just spam you to death if you're not paying attention, which is often because nobody ever takes the footpath.

If anything, the other shade is worse because it can cover the other hallway just as well, if not better, and be out of the players range.

You know, if people used them at all I might know :X

Now as far as the fringe paths go, I've agreed with jcap to make two test versions, one with the fringe paths removed, and the other with them in play. If there's a drastic improvement in gameplay then I'll remove them, but I doubt there will be any impact since no one uses them.

Either way we'll see.

PS: Mass is redoing the entire middle section.

[ZeRk`]

Is this done yet? :{

[Gwunty]

yes
it was done and released
but then a troll spammed the website and had it removed
sorry bro~ :downs:

[ZeRk`]

Give me another beta test Sel. dddddddddddgfgdgfdgfdg

[Sel]

not dead

almost done modeling the new middle, hopefully there will be a beta tommorow(well today at time of posting, but yeah)

Keep in mind the the new area will be very rough, so don't give me a lot of shit over minor issues that I probably already know about!

PS:

Also we're looking for someone who thinks they can UV, create shaders for, and textures for the waterfall.

Anyone who thinks they're up to the task leave a message here.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/waterfall.jpg

PPS: We've tried cutting down the map size, I've taken the original and shrunk the overall length by about 5-10% of what it was before, mass tried valiantly to make something about half the length, but I felt it completely removed most of what made the driving path fun, so we're not using it, and we're sticking with the original concept of sheer size (not that big fuck you all!!), with longer fringe paths that allow you to take longer to get where you're going, but are generally safer.

Now I don't give a fuck how much flak I get for this, because it's staying, and here's why.

The most direct path, which will see the most action anyway is about 5-6 seconds LONGER, than driving base to base in the same vehicle in Danger Canyon, roughly 30+5 seconds. I don't see the issue, but apparently some of you do. We're also sticking with the single chokepoint for the map being the middle, but now with the new model it's much harder to hold, so we'll hopefully see less ridiculous games like we did in the betas, where 2 people hold the entire map.

Now as for the driving: Most of you who are claiming it's too big, are almost all people who I've played with on several occasions over the years, and I know that the majority of you take the walking path on Danger Canyon anyway, regardless of whether there's vehicles available, hell I do the same thing. You know why? It's because the driving path on danger canyon was boring as fuck to drive on. It was all flat, there's one jump in the whole thing, the middle is so open that any dick with an FRG can take you down in seconds, etc. On the occasions when no one is in the middle (the first 50 seconds of the game), you might see some vehicle action in the middle, but other than that, you won't.

Most of the time when I drive DC, and get to the other end in one piece, I almost never (95%) of the time, see anyone in a vehicle drive by. The reasons for this are, the middle is easy to hold, and chokes the entire map, and most of the vehicles that try to get down there simply get wrecked, leaving no vehicles for teammates to take from the base for 60 seconds, and yet again turning everyone to the walking path.

This is exactly what happened in the older betas of Rev.

We're trying to solve this, and so far brainstorming has put forward the following solutions, most of which (have been)/(are going) to be implemented.

Including :

Making the middle harder to hold, more open space, Rockets about a 20 seconds walk away, less cover, etc.

More vehicles in the base. In the older betas we had the DC model, 2 hogs, 2 ghosts. With 16 people this just didn't work. There were almost never vehicles at the base.


What I'm hoping :

Is that this will solve the lack of activity on the vehicle path, and you might actually see some cool vehicle battles on the expansive terrain I made.

With the extended use of vehicles we will see people using the longer fringe paths to get where they're going safer, but not as swiftly.

That the new middle mass made will be a lot funner than the old one, by being tighter, shorter, and overall less of a pistol wanking contest with use for other weapons being found in it.

[n00b1n8R]

I drive DC 50% of the time. >_>
Walking is fucking boring.

[Ganon]

I drive DC 50% of the time. >_>
Walking is fucking boring.

other way around for me lol. plus you are more vulnerable in a vehicle

[Sel]

other way around for me lol. plus you are more vulnerable in a vehicle

You're one of the people I refer to who complained it was too big, yet never take the driving path in it or DC!

[Ganon]

Theres more to it than meets the eye in what I know about danger canyon and how halo gameplay works m'boy. You know this.

[n00b1n8R]

other way around for me lol. plus you are more vulnerable in a vehicle
Bitches don't know bout my ghosting skills.
Or my terrible twitch-aiming.

[Sel]

I said I'd probably have a test ready today, but, I found my civilization 2 cd, and started playing that instead.

maybe tommorow folks!

[Higuy]

I said I'd probably have a test ready today, but, I found my civilization 2 cd, and started playing that instead.

maybe tommorow folks!
do it tomorrow night
i start skool tomorrow
im going to learn to spell skool while there too, hopefully. :saddowns:

[Sel]

building subclusters...
building pvs... building pvs... building structure lens flares...done


structure bsp "levels\revelations\revelations"
BSP has 54959 nodes, 29533 leaves
61264 surfaces and 113187 vertices in 429 material groups
70 portals, 9 clusters

3868Kb collision data (357Kb vertices, 1245Kb edges, 349Kb surfaces)
6991Kb render data (4509Kb vertices, 1297Kb surfaces,
783Kb nodes/leaves, 293Kb clusters)
0Kb pathfinding data
----------------------
12319Kb (without debug information)

hey kids

guess what's happening tommorow

[ZeRk`]

hey kids

guess what's happening tommorow

beta TEST?

[Chainsy]

No he's doing a clearance on his testies because school starts and he won't have time to masturbate.

[Siliconmaster]

No he's doing a clearance on his testies because school starts and he won't have time to masturbate.

:gonk::gonk::gonk::ugh:
Who says there isn't time to masturbate once school starts?

[Sel]

beta TEST?

no

ok yes


No he's doing a clearance on his testies because school starts and he won't have time to masturbate.

shut it youngster, I don't have school.


I got it ingame yesterday, and had a (pre)beta, because I figured there would be a lot of shit to fix before I had the real test, and there was, so hopefully I'll have something ready around 8pm. (4 hours from this post, for you faggots in another timezone)

[chrisk123999]

429 materials? Seems like a lot...

[Siliconmaster]

I'd assume different transparencies/lighting conditions, etc. If those are all individual textures, you'd only use them once. o_0

[Sel]

Uhh, max has maybe 30 materials in the editor right now?

God knows where tool gets it's numbers :\

[Siliconmaster]

Oh, it's probably referring to them by location (for lack of a better name) groups. If you go into guerilla under the lightmaps section, it lists all the material groups, sometimes 8 or more times per material. I've found that those groups are usually near each other spatially.

[Higuy]

Uhh, max has maybe 30 materials in the editor right now?

God knows where tool gets it's numbers :\
when you have transparent objects like glass and lights, it separates them into groups and more materials, at least thats what mine does.

[il Duce Primo]

Or it could be the same thing that happened with the b30 bsps where the material editor copied itself a hundred times, and you only have 70 portals. :(

[Sel]

Or it could be the same thing that happened with the b30 bsps where the material editor copied itself a hundred times, and you only have 70 portals. :(

I redid the portals, but they're still not perfect.

They should be fine for testing purposes though.

[Rook]

I redid the portals, but they're still not perfect.

They should be fine for testing purposes though.

That's what you thought, then I looked at red base

[Siliconmaster]

The missing texturing I was referring to was the generator lights edging in the middle footpath on red side. And for that matter, the edging on blue side is red. Makes it confusing. Blank -> Red, Red -> Blue. Do it. It would also be really nice to have better color indicators in that middle area- right now that edging is the only "directional" coloring, and it's messed up. Maybe some small beacon lights or decorational lighting in the sunken areas?

Here's a screenshot of the empty/directionless area: Note the red blinkies and the blue blinkies on the same side. o_0 No wonder I got lost.
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/1613/emptyl.jpg

Fix this please.
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/5070/uvs2.jpg

And this.
http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/6972/uvs1.jpg

The aforementioned blue side edging:
http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/8810/edging1.jpg

And the missing red side edging:
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/3666/edging2.jpg

O hai, a large boring pit. :P Understandable, but maybe add a fog layer?
http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/6225/beholdagiantpit.jpg

I know fog might mess with the cliff skybox, but maybe it would help blur the bottom of the waterfalls:
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/2484/hurrb.jpg

Overall it looks quite good. Keep up the great work. :D

[Cagerrin]

Mass:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/TalonX/randomstuff/WIP/20090825195605_3m49s.png

Gawd it's so much easier to explain with pics than with words.

[Siliconmaster]

^ I support this post.

[Sel]

Mass:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/TalonX/randomstuff/WIP/20090825195605_3m49s.png

Gawd it's so much easier to explain with pics than with words.

Oh my god

we are doing this

[Mass]

Mass:
Gawd it's so much easier to explain with pics than with words.

you know I totally understood what you said right

that's exactly what I pictured

thanks, though

[Cagerrin]

you know I totally understood what you said right

that's exactly what I pictured

thanks, though
sort of

I think by the time you actually replied I was being shot at. :saddowns:

E: Also, going through the map right now and finding incongruent stuff.

[il Duce Primo]

The map clipping was an awsome feature. It added unique and interesting gameplay. :haw:

The layout of the map still is just random. I agree it is much better than last time. I can actually walk to the center and then to the other base in an ok length of time. I found that the terrain helps the vehicles too much. Like a person would jump in the hog with the flag and ride off and the terrain would give the vehicles too much cover.

[Ganon]

I'd like to point out the map has clipping errors! :trollpost:

[BobtheGreatII]

So my suggestions:

-I know it's still a WIP, but laying out some scenery would be nice.
-Falling Damage needs taken out or something, because falling off small ledges and crap is really annoying.
-Bland empty pit as said before.
-The builder sentinels or whatever, need to go, and so does High Charity. They really pull from the beautiful skybox. Not to mention that there is no lens flare where the sun should be, yet you still have all the little flairs that appear when there is a sun.
-Waterfall... although it's really a good idea, It doesn't look very good... Is it a bunch of separate planes with the waterfall texture on it? If I were you I would just make it one plane with the waterfall UV'd in a pattern. Would look better.
-You can shoot the overshield and it falls right through the little platform under it.
-Also you can pick up the fuel-rod cannon through the platform.
-Blue laser bolt thing that shoots up has a flare, the red one does not. Looks silly.

That's all for now. It's really coming along though. :iamafag:

[Ki11a_FTW]

selentic is still waiting for teh lag for the waterfall

[Con]

teh lag is busy, he wants me to do it. im busy. nyoro~n

[rossmum]

I drive DC 50% of the time. >_>
Walking is fucking boring.
Get the fuck out, walking DC owns because 90% of the time nobody bothers to look for walkers

[Siliconmaster]

-I know it's still a WIP, but laying out some scenery would be nice.
-Falling Damage needs taken out or something, because falling off small ledges and crap is really annoying.
-The builder sentinels or whatever, need to go, and so does High Charity. They really pull from the beautiful skybox. Not to mention that there is no lens flare where the sun should be, yet you still have all the little flairs that appear when there is a sun.

Agreed. However, I kinda liked High Charity. The other floaty things just looked pasted on. If you want stuff out there, a la Construct, have them moving or something.

[Sel]

So my suggestions:

-I know it's still a WIP, but laying out some scenery would be nice.

Had to populate the map in around 30 minutes from scratch, I did what I could with that. The next test will have a lot more in it.

-Falling Damage needs taken out or something, because falling off small ledges and crap is really annoying.

Uhhh

-Bland empty pit as said before.

Fog planes can't be added without proper portalling, when it's done you won't see the bottom or sides of the pit.

-The builder sentinels or whatever, need to go, and so does High Charity. They really pull from the beautiful skybox. Not to mention that there is no lens flare where the sun should be, yet you still have all the little flairs that appear when there is a sun.

There's a flare for the sun...

-Waterfall... although it's really a good idea, It doesn't look very good... Is it a bunch of separate planes with the waterfall texture on it? If I were you I would just make it one plane with the waterfall UV'd in a pattern. Would look better.

Right now it's just sitting there, no one knows how to set it up right, and neither do I; teh lag is too busy to fix it.

-You can shoot the overshield and it falls right through the little platform under it.

Will look into this

-Also you can pick up the fuel-rod cannon through the platform.

Will look into this too

-Blue laser bolt thing that shoots up has a flare, the red one does not. Looks silly.

Those are placeholders, I think there is a flare as well, but they're glitched so that only one renders at a time, idk.

That's all for now. It's really coming along though. :iamafag:

Thanks for the suggestions and notifications.

[ZeRk`]

FUCK

I'll do the waterfall. hit me up on xfire Sel :):):);):0;0;0;:0

[king_nothing_]

I prefer the 1st image in the progression images. The newest looks too gloomy. Grass and shit is nicer than sand imo.

Everything looks really bland. Everything is a tanish color.

You picked to use a desert as your environment. Just because it's a desert doesn't mean it should be passed off automaticly as ok to be boring. Everything is very monotone, so add some more colors to it.
I just want to say that I agree with the above opinions. The coloring of the map is very bland. The original textures with the grass and reddish-brown rock walls looked a lot better.

[Con]

Just a few notes about the sky:
-Sel must have an older version of the sky since there's no actual sun, just the lens flare. It's been fixed already.
-I'm going to add an animated cloud layer to the sky like the rest of the halo maps have.

[Sel]

Just a few notes about the sky:
-Sel must have an older version of the sky since there's no actual sun, just the lens flare. It's been fixed already.
-I'm going to add an animated cloud layer to the sky like the rest of the halo maps have.

I have the latest sky, and there was a lens flare in the map, I don't really know what bob's talking about :|

[StankBacon]

so am i the only one who thinks this map is pretty bad? sky and all....

sorry sel, there is a lot to it, and its pretty impressive, but it just sucks...

[Cortexian]

so am i the only one who thinks this map is pretty bad? sky and all....

sorry sel, there is a lot to it, and its pretty impressive, but it just sucks...
No, but until the clipping is fixed and we can have a serious play test I won't pass judgment.

[Con]

I have the latest sky, and there was a lens flare in the map, I don't really know what bob's talking about :|
I didn't say lens flare, I said the sun is missing:
http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/8448/41981774.jpg
I sent you an updated version of the sky with that fixes--unless you lost it like you lost my glass textures ;p

[Sel]

so am i the only one who thinks this map is pretty bad? sky and all....

sorry sel, there is a lot to it, and its pretty impressive, but it just sucks...

:(

In defense though, there was some important stuff left out of the walking path, namely the teleporters that make it so you dont have to walk right up to and through the enemy base :\

As for the driving path though, I thought it seemed to work a lot better than it did in the old tests.

[Rentafence]

ProRentatip: Work on making a fun layout before you go prettying the level up.

[Sel]

There will be another test today, with a few alterations of the middle section, and with the new teleporters that complete the walking path added in.

7pm (-5)

[rossmum]

how many hours is that from now, i'm too tired to work it out

4:22 am here right now

e/ please answer soon because i plan on crashing shortly unless it'll be before 2pm my time

[Sel]

It's 2:30 (-5) here

so 4 and a half hours from this post

[rossmum]

god dammit

i'll try and stay up but chances are i won't make it

[Higuy]

For those Ice surfaces, you guys should do what they did in the Halo 3 level "The ark". They had flat surfaces with a texture that was sand, but you could see a sandy forerunner panel under it. I'll try to find a picture..
ehh...
heres a ok picture. look at the ground and how the forerunner pannels show threw the sand. I bet Con could do something good for that right there.
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_ZSHw--_q8bg/ScncbJJ-6aI/AAAAAAAAUVU/G3dIYM0zu88/Halo+3:+Famine+Skull+Platform.jpg

[ThePlague]

P sure they said those things would end up being glass.

[Cortexian]

For those Ice surfaces, you guys should do what they did in the Halo 3 level "The ark". They had flat surfaces with a texture that was sand, but you could see a sandy forerunner panel under it. I'll try to find a picture..
ehh...
heres a ok picture. look at the ground and how the forerunner pannels show threw the sand. I bet Con could do something good for that right there.
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_ZSHw--_q8bg/ScncbJJ-6aI/AAAAAAAAUVU/G3dIYM0zu88/Halo+3:+Famine+Skull+Platform.jpg
They already said it was going to be glass in the final release. :eng101:

[Sel]

A lot of clipping issues have been repaired, there's still the occasional clip, but for the most part it should be a lot more playable for tonights test.

I've also reworked how players teleport to the middle, and UV'd a lot of stuff in the middle as well, so it's a lot less gray.

Added lights to the middle.

Changed removed the FRG, and placed a rocket in a different place. The Powerup is where it was before.

Deepened the pit so that players who drive vehicles into it should die instead of just getting to the bottom.

[Higuy]

They already said it was going to be glass in the final release. :eng101:Why glass? To be honest that doesn't make a whole lot of sense, unless there's forerunner stuff under it..

[rossmum]

about an hour left right

still awake, dunno how long it'll last

[Sel]

about an hour left right

still awake, dunno how long it'll last

Go ross, you can do it!

[rossmum]

i think i can make it another 3-4 hours alright so long as i keep my brain busy and get some adrenaline going every now and then

past that it's anyone's guess

[Sel]

There was a lot of flak given to the desert theme in the test today, so while I know this community can barely agree that breathing is a good idea, I'm going to ask for some opinions on what you think the map atmosphere should be. There is now a poll attached to this thread for this purose.

Nothing visual is final yet, neither is the desert, so vote for whatever you think would look best.

[Timo]

Most CE maps are forest themes, be different. If you can get a nice light/heavy snow effect going then a snow map. If not, desert is fine.

e: It seems that my Print Screen key is broken so I can't show you parts of the map I don't like :C

[ZeRk`]

Desert, only if possible could you make it not a solid color, and it varies a little? It would make it lessss bland.

[Higuy]

I think Forest would be great.
It's easy to replicate in the Halo engine and easy to not make it look boring either, unlike a desert theme. Though Desert can look good, like shown in Halo 3, it took alot of work and environmental effects to get it not be so boring. ( same with everything else, but this one seems like it would need ALOT of nice stuff for a good atmosphere other then a super pretty sky, and great architecture.) Snow is always cool, but im not much of a fan of it really, and it probally wouldn't look very good with the awesome sky you guys have now.

[Rook]

Snow or desert, I'll decide and vote later

[Con]

What about melting snow like portent has?

[Cagerrin]

Snow... probally wouldn't look very good with the awesome sky you guys have now.
Meh, it worked in Halo 3.

Which incidentally, is how I'd see a snow version of this. Have it overlooking an area like this (http://www.majhost.com/gallery/TalonX/randomstuff/Inspiration/Terrain-Buildings/Halo/1440660-full.jpg), rather than the waterfall, and use Jcap's suggestion from page 58.

[Siliconmaster]

I'm a fan of desert if you can add bushes and stuff to make it more interesting. As for forest, I think that would also look cool, even if a lot of Halo maps look like that.

[Mass]

!!!CHALLENGE!!!

anyone who can make a badass, fucked-up looking alien cactus that is approximately the same size, shape, and visual interest of a pine tree scenery is a god

or draws a good picture of one, that would be good too

[jcap]

I think a forest would look awful. Halo looks like complete crap with its basic ground textures. Without an engine like Halo 3 and it's RBG blending, you can't make a map that's grass and rock look good, especially when it's huge.

A desert would only look good if you put enough effort into making a ton of stick trees. You'd have to emulate The Ark as best as possible, and nothing short of that.

I actually still like the idea of snow. The waterfall would still be able to stay, but in the distance, you would see all ice glaciers and stuff. Think about how Avalanche is in Halo 3. The map is beautiful. Snow would be good if you placed snowy trees throughout the map, although I don't know if Halo, being so young, would have fully grown trees within a few weeks of time. If you look at Avalanche in Halo 3 and aim for that beauty, you can really make it look nice. Likewise, if you target The Ark, you can make it look beautiful that way too.

[StankBacon]

What about melting snow like portent has?

that's what i was thinking only reversed, since it will be snowing :p

if done right, that could look really good

[Cagerrin]

I actually still like the idea of snow. The waterfall would still be able to stay, but in the distance, you would see all ice glaciers and stuff. Think about how Avalanche is in Halo 3. The map is beautiful. Snow would be good if you placed snowy trees throughout the map, although I don't know if Halo, being so young, would have fully grown trees within a few weeks of time. If you look at Avalanche in Halo 3 and aim for that beauty, you can really make it look nice. Likewise, if you target The Ark, you can make it look beautiful that way too.
Scratch my idea, this is far better.

[English Mobster]

Avalanche is ON Alpha Halo II, iirc.

[il Duce Primo]

Mass and me learned from experience how meh snow can be. Snow is just white and shades of grey. It's even worse than doing a desert. Atleast a desert has some orange and reds in it. Honostly, I would go with the traditional Halo look with not too many trees.

[English Mobster]

Mass and I learned from experience how meh snow can be. Snow is just white and shades of grey. It's even worse than doing a desert. Atleast a desert has some orange and reds in it. Honostly, I would go with the traditional Halo look with not too many trees.
[/nazi]
If you take some stock Halo textures and add snow to them, I think it'll look great, but I'm not so knowledgeable about snow as much as I am about urban environments.

[Sel]

I really liked the desert idea because it was fairly unique to halo maps, I also like the idea of a lush forest, but honestly halo 1's engine is so limited, it wouldn't look that great, deserts give you a little leverage with the fact they don't need to be packed full of vegetation to look good. The same is true for snow, but I'm not keen on that either because it's a lot less original.

[Horns]

The only thing about snow, is there are sooooooo many maps out there that are snow. Same thing with forerunner maps. There so many of them out there. I want something new and different that's not just the same thing the last guy put out.

[Siliconmaster]

The only thing about snow, is there are sooooooo many maps out there that are snow. Same thing with forerunner maps. There so many of them out there. I want something new and different that's not just the same thing the last guy put out.

I do want to point out that though there a lot of forerunner maps, not all of them are actually good looking. :downs:

New and different is always good though.

[Rentafence]

How about having some big ass space trees everywhere, and have it set in the middle of autumn? Big trees would make sense for leaves being everywhere, and you wouldn't need too many, solving the issue of having a shitty looking forest Halo 1 can't do well, as you said. Imagine alien weeping willow looking trees hanging off the side of the cliffs. It would go perfectly with the sky.

[rossmum]

If you can make it actually look good, desert. Failing that, a forest, I guess.

And for fuck's sake, put little bollards in the base entrances to stop vehicles from getting inside. Seriously. Being run over repeatedly in spawn is fucking retarded and is what makes me immensely dislike Sidewinder and Blood Gulch.

[n00b1n8R]

Honestly, I'd love to see a swamp map because they're so underdone but it would probably look horrible with the sky's colours.

[Siliconmaster]

Plus swamp maps generally have a viewing distance of 100 yards or less. With a layout like this one it would be nice to see vehicles or people coming from farther away.

[Mass]

So we had a (relatively) competitive test tonight. I had quite a bit of fun, and liked how it was playing. We have some heatmaps for everyone to look at, and remember that even if all you have is the most insignificant piece of criticism, it's important to spam sel with it.

DEATHS
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/nate-the-great_photos/deaths.jpg

KILLS
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o97/nate-the-great_photos/kills.jpg

[Sel]

Gameplay was great

the map plays amazingly in an organized 5v5

fuck you all~~~~

[n00b1n8R]

Can you overlay the kills/deaths with different colours?

[Con]

kills green, deaths red

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/3237/41134808.jpg

[klange]

Hm. I know it's not really the place, but that could look a lot better if the map geometry were textured, the arrows were moved up vertically (on top of the map) so you can see them, and then actually filled rather than wireframed. (Which is basically what Cerebrum will do).

Also, the map is looking pretty good so far.

[jcap]

Can you please get rid of the 45 degree angles, and make everything not so damn tall. It's terrible for both gameplay and aesthetics when you have a 45 degree hill that takes forever to walk up.

Also, did you ever even change anything except for the middle? The vehicle path is still insanely far out as before.

[Ganon]

http://zgaming.net/zgshack/images/nsxleqlin1z1ikbkbumu.jpg
I showed this to sel, but I'm curious who else would be in agreement with an alteration similar to this. As well as this statement:

"removing the long path that runs on the outside creates a more condensed and forced path to take to the middle. this creates a more definite strategy, eliminates some possible confusions, and gives vehicles (particularly ghosts) less of a navigatory capping advantage on this side."

if u are oblivious, brown=cliff and tan=terrain

[Mass]

Can you please get rid of the 45 degree angles, and make everything not so damn tall. It's terrible for both gameplay and aesthetics when you have a 45 degree hill that takes forever to walk up.

Also, did you ever even change anything except for the middle? The vehicle path is still insanely far out as before.
Those are thirty degrees, and I'm giving it a grander ceiling to eliminate the claustrophobia in that hallway, also going to frame the keyhole doors on the side and make the drop-chutes no one uses in the middle more obvious.

oh and the annoying 45 degree angle trenches you can get stuck in are finally getting their grates and glass coverings hopefully

As for the vehicle path, sel was already doing what ganon just posted last night soo...

[sdavis117]

http://screenshot.xfire.com/screenshot/natural/0cb33928375582fd28ee0bb42c1330597fbe9003.png



Here is a picture of the old Alpha I was talking about in the Podcast.

[Limited]

That is sexi :D

[jcap]

It looks like any other generic map with grass. If you can somehow manage to make it as beautiful as Higuy's maps, that might be a different story. But I just think that grass + huge map = ugly shit.

[Advancebo]

Needs custom lightmaps :haw:

[=sw=warlord]

Needs custom lightmaps :haw:
It has custom lightmaps.
You think their using lightmaps from bloodgulch or something?

[Advancebo]

It has custom lightmaps.
You think their using lightmaps from bloodgulch or something?

I mean like baked lightmaps. Not Sapien lightmaps.

[Sel]

Here is a picture of the old Alpha I was talking about in the Podcast.

Am I the only one who think that looks fucking terrible compared to what we have now?

:\

[Higuy]

i like the blood gulch type look more rather then the extremely barren wasteland thats p boring

[Sel]

I've been toying with the idea of some fucking weird ass weather wall thing going down the middle, and having one side of the level be barren, dead, desert, close to what it is now, with a lot more shit in it, dead trees, cacti etc, and then having the other be lush rainy forest.

Now while I thought it sounded good in concept, I started trying to think of how to do it, and well, that's where I'm having trouble. How would we set up the sky to work with that being the most prominent issue.

Otherwise I'd have to tone that back a bit, have one side be dead and desertesque, and have the other have sparse vegetation and oasises.

Anyone liking that idea, or should we just stick with having a constant theme throughout?


As far as changes go: Mass has done some shit to the middle, and I've fixed a somewhat important jump on the red side immediately exiting the middle cave.

[Siliconmaster]

Hmm. Would definitely be interesting, but "lushy rain forest in CE" seems like an oxymoron. I mean, swamp mb, but forest itself might be tough. The concept is cool though. Also, balancing it might be hard- vegetation has more cover than desert (unless purposefully balanced).

[Sel]

Hmm. Would definitely be interesting, but "lushy rain forest in CE" seems like an oxymoron. I mean, swamp mb, but forest itself might be tough. The concept is cool though. Also, balancing it might be hard- vegetation has more cover than desert (unless purposefully balanced).

Ehh, you know, thinking back on it, I'd rather just stick with one side being dead, and one having sparse oases and vegetation, grass etc, to mix up the sand.

[Siliconmaster]

Maybe a small stream. Water=vegetation. It would give a natural reason for the difference.

[Timo]

Have the water dammed somehow on one side and have it flow down the other. Just add a rut down the center of the deserted side, or something.

[StankBacon]

map = ugly shit.


i agree.



:haw:

[Sel]

i agree.



:haw:

That's funny coming from someone who exclusively plays shitty box maps with orange and gray textures in css :haw:

[Ganon]

That's funny coming from someone who exclusively plays shitty box maps with orange and gray textures in css :haw:

http://zgaming.net/zgshack/images/2gsush48ujzxh5e02irl.jpg

or wait... go head :U

[StankBacon]

rofl.

[Sel]

This is why Revelations > All of CSS.

It's also why tf2 updates are so far apart.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/gaben.png

[ThePlague]

:o holy fuck that's awesome

[Corndogman]

Am I the only one who think that looks fucking terrible compared to what we have now?

:\

No, I agree. I'm sick of seeing boring grass fields with cliffs and boring lighting. I think the lighting looked good in that pic, but that's it. Desert just has to be done well, and you're on the right track.

I second the stream/oasis idea.

[Inferno]

Model some cactus's and alien cow skulls and put them in. Make some GOOD detail sand (having the alpha alternate between wavy and non wavy sand) and get some god damn animated tumble weeds.

</map>

[Dwood]

Man I was hoping for a good snow map. I find myself in want of a map with the atmosphere of the icy, barren land that is Coldsnap, but keeps the fun and balance.

[Ganon]

alien cow skulls

forunners be herdin dem cattles

[sdavis117]

ebI5lkLRTdg

If you are going to do a desert theme, and you do make skulls for scenery, make them the skulls of the creatures at 0:53.

[Con]

what
no

dont do that

[TEMPTii]

That must have been the most epic thing of its time [that preview] and it gave me chills :]

Maybe the desert could have salt crystals like that in Halo 3

[Sel]

I've made some final gameplay changes to the BSP, if all goes well in our next "competitive" playtest we will switch our efforts from manhandling this into the ground, and instead throw on some makeup, eye liner, etc, and start making it look better.

This may or may not include a model random scenery that would fit in this map contest.

[TEMPTii]

Well keep up the good work, it looks great :D

[ZeRk`]

Sooooo beta soon?

[Ganon]

I see the poll results made life easier.

[Con]

^
heh

What other kinds of environments could we have... Maybe there's something that people would like even more than those 3

[Dwood]

^
heh

What other kinds of environments could we have... Maybe there's something that people would like even more than those 3

None that imho, unless the map is designed for it, would make it any better.

[Cagerrin]

Tundra? (http://www.cas.vanderbilt.edu/bioimages/biohires/ecoregions/h51117tundra3302.jpg)

[Higuy]

Tundra? (http://www.cas.vanderbilt.edu/bioimages/biohires/ecoregions/h51117tundra3302.jpg)
That's what Fracture was aimed at first, though Halo ce only allowing 2 detail maps didn't allow us to expand our capabilities in putting snow onto the ground texture..

[Ki11a_FTW]

That's what Fracture was aimed at first, though Halo ce only allowing 2 detail maps didn't allow us to expand our capabilities in putting snow onto the ground texture..

you can get around that by making multiple ground shaders though

[sdavis117]

Lava map.

[Ki11a_FTW]

Lava map.

now that you mention it, i can picture this map with the theme of inside a huge cave, or hole

[TEMPTii]

now that you mention it, i can picture this map with the theme of inside a huge cave, or hole
Not with the bases over the edges D:

[BobtheGreatII]

Holy crap. This seems like such a great idea. Needs a huge erupting volcano or 3 in the skybox, and ash coming down from the sky. DO THIS NOW! :aaaaa:

[TEMPTii]

Omg ._.
While you're at it get the Pyrotechnic device tag from HCE o 3o

[Ki11a_FTW]

Not with the bases over the edges D:

i mean like a giant underground thing, revalations being towards the side of the hole then the hole goes deeper where the edges are

[UnevenElefant5]

I just saw the poll, don't know how late I am in saying this, but I'd prefer a desert theme, since forest is overdone and snow just isn't that appealing to me.


E: just read the last page, lava sound a lot better than anything else.

[TEMPTii]

i mean like a giant underground thing, revalations being towards the side of the hole then the whole goes deeper where the edges are
Oooohhh. So Revelations would be at a ledge inside the whole?

[Sel]

Lava waterfall lmfao.

[Ganon]

this map will be fine as desert when it's populated...

[TEMPTii]

Lava waterfall lmfao.
XD win

[Sel]

this map will be fine as desert when it's populated...

Quoting this.

[Dwood]

Quoting this.

Someone should do different themes for each version or something... Perhaps have like 4 bsps and just switch between them lol (jk)

[Sel]

I'm perfectly fine with giving out the model and scenario files to trustworthy members of the community if they want to try a different theme on rev, if I don't feel satisfied with what we come out with.

[Sel]

Small update lol

Did some detailing work.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/0screenshot00.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l42/selentic/Models/1screenshot00.jpg


Sooooo beta soon?

Well maybe if you fukkin went online :saddowns:

[Siliconmaster]

Nice. Looks good! :D I can't even tell what section that used to be.


Which was it? o_o Comparison pics mb?

[Cortexian]

Portent-like snow has my vote.

[Sel]

Nice. Looks good! :D I can't even tell what section that used to be.


Which was it? o_o Comparison pics mb?

Take out the bottom and the glass, and you've got them lol.

[FluffyDucky™]

I'm guessing the middle bit has changed now since I haven't been around much? Looks good! :)

[Sel]

Several up to date screenshots have been uploaded to my /Levels Album, check them out once they're moderated.

They serve mostly as an archive for later one, once the map is textured properly, so we can see how far we've come heh.

[Higuy]

Sel, I think you should use the default Halo textures on the interior of the structures, so they don't look sandy and what not.

[Sel]

Sel, I think you should use the default Halo textures on the interior of the structures, so they don't look sandy and what not.

I was considering it, and swapped the shaders a while ago, honestly though, I'll take yellow over gray any day, and I'll take CON MAKING ENTIRELY FUCKING NEW TEXTURES, over that any day.

you hearin me con

Im gonna get medieval on yo ass

[Mass]

http://www.absurdintellectual.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/william20-20crack20pipe.jpg
+
http://blogs.kansas.com/weblog/files/pliers.jpg
+
http://tzenger.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/blow_torch.jpg

[Sel]

mass has the idea

[Bastinka]

Some of the textures used for the walls and ceilings look quite bland and dull the overall interesting look of the map. That's the only thing I can point out so far, looks good.

[Sel]

Some of the textures used for the walls and ceilings look quite bland and dull the overall interesting look of the map. That's the only thing I can point out so far, looks good.

Look up 3 posts.

Not really sure about entirely new textures though.

[Arteen]

Anything but snow. Snow is boring and overdone. If you choose to do desert, then you'll need to do something to make the map not look quite so bland and monochromatic.

[hry]

How about desert with a grass theme?, I mean desert with oasis and stuff, should be great.

[SnaFuBAR]

Go with lightly forested. You need mossy textures and small plants and anything but that god-awful halo grass texture. Even if you have a waterfall in a desert theme, you're doing it wrong because you have no grasses or small plants growing near it.

http://www.houstonfreeways.com/modern/images/2007-04-22_arizona/IMG_5794_florence_kelvin_20070422.jpg
http://www.associationamur.org/images/cascade4.jpg

If you're going to do something, do it right.

[Inferno]

There are PLENTY of grassy forest canyons in halo. Desert all the way man.

[sdavis117]

If you are going for desert, at least show us the textures you are actually going to use. The ones you have now for the ground textures look horrible.

And still turn that GIANT FUCKING ROCK into a GIANT FUCKING IGLOO.

[Sel]

The ones you have now for the ground textures look horrible.

Yeah, don't I know it.

It's a placeholder, just like every other texture is at this point.

Con will update y'all when he gets to them.

[UnevenElefant5]

I liked hry's oasis idea. Put some nice little palm trees and water ponds to break up the desert.

[Lateksi]

This (http://hce.halomaps.org/index.cfm?fid=4532) one has some minimal vegetation. I imagine it would look boring if there was no vegetation at all. Same goes for Revelations, I guess. And one more thing. Is there sand on the outside structures? I'm asking because I haven't played the latest versions.

[Rob Oplawar]

If you're going to do something, do it right.
Do what snaf said

[Sever]

Along the same vein as what Lateksi is saying, you should add some blowing sand particle effects, put sand along the same face of every structure and cliff-wall, and build up dunes facing the same way. It might be too late to properly implement that, but I'm just throwing the idea out there. Hell, I think I'll use that for one of my forthcoming map concepts.

e: and yeah, do whatever Snaf tells you to, since he's right pretty much all of the time.

[Invader Veex]

Do something like Arteen's map, Twist. http://hce.halomaps.org/index.cfm?fid=2987

[Mass]

I'm still trying to come up with an interesting idea for a space cactus, maybe some sort of giant agave like thing.

Frankly, we've talked about this and there really isn't any logical place for water to flow to in the map, so unless we have ponds/marshes I doubt there will be any of that.

Personally I want to try a dry-grass look like Narrows CE

(BOY SURE GLAD I HAVE THIS NICE CONCLUSIVE POLL, heh)

[n00b1n8R]

Why go for wacky xeno-cactus?
It's not like any of the life on Halo is particularly alien, just go with a normal cactus vOv

E: though if the strucuture is still so early a WIP that the ring its self hasn't been completed, I doubt there'd be any life at all there anyway lol.

[Rob Oplawar]

logical
When have Halo multiplayer maps ever been logical? Do what looks nice (and doesn't interrupt gameplay).

[Cortexian]

Do all three of the themes and include a BSP switching button in the menu or something.

:)

[Con]

Do all three of the themes and include a BSP switching button in the menu or something.

:)
no


shows we cant make our mind up
increases filesize
more work

[Cortexian]

no


shows we cant make our mind up
increases filesize
more work


yes


gives the users a choice of which texture they want, which is obviously required if the poll is any indication
filesize isn't an issue for 90% of the people that will play with
shows how dedicated you guys are