Is there interest in BlueStreak being ported to other 3D programs?

[SGWraith]

For people who don't own or have access to 3ds Max, if you had a free/cheap alternative to using Gmax (such as for making your content/maps or just using it as an exporter where you do most of the work in your application of choice), would you switch and drop Gmax like a dirty sock or is Gmax good enough for what you want to use it for? Or would you rather not have to use Gmax at all?

Over the years I seem to remember hearing complaints about Gmax and have wondered if it deserved that reputation. While it does have its limitations, such as having no builtin importers/exporters and having no renderer, it does seem to have all the necessary modelling tools and TheGhost's plugins do work with it. On the other hand, while I know that even programs like MS Paint are capable of making something that looks good, such as this MS Paint Car by Pixelgod (http://www.pixelgod.net/img/gallery/impreza.jpg) (which he did without a tablet!), I also know that a good interface and a decent tool set do go a long way in helping one keep their sanity, making the job easier and more enjoyable for us "normal" people.

Personal preference and one's grasp of 3D concepts are important, too, in choosing what to use but what software do you all use and wish was supported by TheGhost's plugins? Or are people content with using Gmax if they don't have access to 3ds Max for their Halo import/export needs? Porting code isn't the easiest thing to do and the target candidate program would need to be able to output things the way the Hek expects them but it could be done since TheGhost generously released his plugins under the GPL license. Anyone interested in seeing someone try this? Or is there not really a need for it?

[Llama Juice]

If there was an exporter for Maya I'd be the happiest penguin on the ice, but... that's not gunna happen haha.

[Con]

Maya

[SGWraith]

What I had been wondering about was whether or not people liked using Gmax for map making or if they would want to switch to another program if it was free/cheap and had BlueStreak plugin support. But if all of you are using Maya then I must be a pauper, lol.

[TomClancy]

They still offer Maya PLE, no?

[SGWraith]

No, Autodesk discontinued that probably the same time they cut support for Gmax, etc. Cheapest student version of Maya goes for $200 and has a time limit of 14 months so I think I'll pass on that.

[klange]

Autodesk didn't own Maya when Gmax was discontinued. PLE just went out in the last year or so.

If you want to port it to something, try Blender. All the scripting is done in Python.

[FreedomFighter7]

If you want to port it to something, try Blender. All the scripting is done in Python.

FUCK YEAH!!! I was going to suggest blender!!! I LOVE blender, its free, can model, animate, render, UVW map, has materials, etc. I've been wanting to create a blender map and model exporter/importer but I don't know how. Blender has a steep learning curve, but once you get to know it, you can model fast, and have things done in no time, and create awesome models.

[=sw=warlord]

Maya
Milkshape:bunchies:

[SGWraith]

Blender is a good candidate but does it still have that limit of 16 materials per object? Or is that not a problem for mapping for Halo?

Wings3D seems interesting too because its native file format obeys the sealed world rule and has a good interface. The downside of the program is that it uses Erlang for a scripting language which, while not hard to learn, isn't that common. Also updates to the api tend to make plugin maintenance a bit tougher since the developer is still actively changing things and making improvements.

Milkshape is 30-day shareware which costs money to register, right? I don't know much about it aside from the fact that it has a lot of import/export options and a plugin sdk available. If you use the program a lot, Warlord, could you tell me how it stacks up against Gmax? It looks like all the basics are there but I haven't used it before. What language are plugins written in? Python?

[klange]

Blender? Material limits?
Regardless, you can only get 16 materials on an object in Halo anyway.

[SGWraith]

Isn't the material system how Halo handles shaders, portals, and other special properties? If the limit in Halo is 16 then I guess its a none issue but I had always thought it might have been higher then that. My only other concern about using Blender from the limited research I did was that TheGhost's jms exporter used a bitarray for part of its functionality and Python (and therefore Blender) don't have those as far as I know, though I think I found someone who was working on implementing them. Regardless, I think the bitarray behavior could be faked if I understood what it does correctly.

[klange]

Python? Not have a bit array?
Just make an array [], Python doesn't care what data goes in it.

[Siliconmaster]

What I had been wondering about was whether or not people liked using Gmax for map making or if they would want to switch to another program if it was free/cheap and had BlueStreak plugin support. But if all of you are using Maya then I must be a pauper, lol.

The three biggest problems with gmax I can see, having used it extensively before switching (thank god) to 3ds Max are:

*Missing features such as stl check, first-person mode, etc.

*Software rendering vs hardware rendering. I can run a very complex scene with all settings on full in Max. Same map, same settings in gmax, 3 frame/second. Terrible.

*Export options. Those have been much assisted by programs such as chimp and later bluestreak. Still, it is nearly impossible to convert something from gmax directly to max without first getting it ingame. Using gmax. It's circular. - _ -

So yeah. The short of it is yeah, it would be great if people could use free or cheap programs to make halo maps.

[Llama Juice]

Maya uses Python now too :3 Ever since Maya 2008?... or 8.5 don't remember...but... yea :3

[SGWraith]

I wonder how much of the plugin functionality could be abstracted to allow the core of the python plugin to be reused with custom wrappers/interfaces to handle each specific program. If most 3D programs have Python scripting that could open the door for a lot of different modelling programs. :)

[Cagerrin]

Would Sketchup be possible? Pretty sure the scripting language it uses is open source.

[SGWraith]

Sketchup uses Ruby for scripting, so if the documentation on the api is good enough I don't see why one couldn't try.

[Advancebo]

Yeah but sketchup models have many errors, Im sure an unedited model wont go through tool.

[Cagerrin]

Yeah but sketchup models have many errors, Im sure an unedited model wont go through tool.
As far as I can tell, the errors come from the export/import process needed to get Sketchup files into Gmax, not from any fault of the models themselves.

[Con]

We've had polls on this before. Maya comes second to Max in number of users iirc :smug:

I just want some Maya love, we always get the shaft...

[Reaper Man]

Maya

Maya
Maya

[Roostervier]

Maya

[Disaster]

Maya

[Moses]

Llama told me to say Maya

[Malloy]

lol Sketchup :P

On a serious note, i havent read the last 3 pages but does Bluestreak cover Gmax?

E: that'd help alot fo people who cant afford a legit 3d Studio/Maya package.

[Llama Juice]

does Bluestreak cover Gmax?
Yep, it does.

[Anton]

Maya, its severely lacking in Halo Support, an exporter would be great, really.

[SGWraith]

Python? Not have a bit array?
Just make an array [], Python doesn't care what data goes in it.

Thanks for the info, AdmiralBacon. Having studied TheGhost's exporter for a bit more I think I can easily get by without them and just use a regular array. I've always wanted to learn Python and have been meaning to start using Blender too so I think I'll give it a shot. You following news on Blender 2.5? I found this (http://irukado.org/archives/2009/05/blender-25s-python-uiplugin-api-a-huge-leap-forward/) to be quite interesting.


Maya uses Python now too :3

Thats good to know so I'll keep that in mind. I'll come back to this later but if anyone could find out if I could do this 100% in Python without touching Mel script that would be great.

[FreedomFighter7]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Llama Juice http://www.modacity.net/forums/styles/modacity/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.modacity.net/forums/showthread.php?p=418323#post418323)
Maya

Quote:
Originally Posted by Con http://www.modacity.net/forums/styles/modacity/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.modacity.net/forums/showthread.php?p=418330#post418330)
Maya

Maya
Why not do both (maya) and (blender)? I think its a good idea to use blender, its free, anyone can pick it up.

PS: I LOATHE gmax, I tried it for a while, its a load of shit, gives me a headache is incredibly slow (slow as in modeling time). Gmax can suck it.

[SGWraith]

Why not do both (maya) and (blender)? I think its a good idea to use blender, its free, anyone can pick it up.

It was my plan to attempt do both if I got that far. I'll try for Blender first though since I have it. Once I get that working I'll see what I can do about a Maya version. I found some good Python resources but I'm still doing research on what it would take.

[Llama Juice]

Thats good to know so I'll keep that in mind. I'll come back to this later but if anyone could find out if I could do this 100% in Python without touching Mel script that would be great.

Yes, you can.

In Maya you can do more with Python now than you could with Mel.