Star Citizen by Chris Roberts (Freelancer, Wing Commander, Privateer, etc)

[Cortexian]

Not sure if any of you noticed the site www.robertsspaceindustries.com (http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com) previously, but Chris has launched the funding goals for his new game. Space Citizen.

Check out the announcement video from GDC 2012:
http://www.gamespot.com/shows/gamespot-live/?event=roberts_space_industries_gdc_panel20121010

And the official site I linked to above for more information. This is going to be a PC game, a proper PC game with none of the limitations that developing for console imposes. The scale is going to be massive, the community interaction is going to be excellent (discovered a new jump hole to a new system? It gets named after you. Have a really cool ship design? Submit it to the developers and they'll review it, if it passes spec then they'll add it into the game and maybe even let you earn royalties off it if other people buy it).

If you've ever played Freelancer or Wing Commander then you're going to LOVE this game. The graphics shown off so far have blown every other game in the genre out of the water by far. Knowing Chris the story is going to be amazing, and the multiplayer features sound absolutely awesome.

Now I don't want to go into to much detail, as I want you guys to form your own opinions on it. I highly suggest you check it out!

http://starcitizen.robertsspaceindustries.com/


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqIC2B9UVPM

[Warsaw]

You beat me to it.

So. Fucking. Excited.

Don't forget the Kotaku link (http://kotaku.com/5950453/you-loved-wing-commander-now-meet-the-shiny-successor-that-will-bring-space-sims-into-the-21st-century), too.

[Cortexian]

I grabbed the Wingnut $125 pledge.

Btw, did I mention that it runs on CryEngine 3?

It seems like CryEngine 3 has spurred a lot of amazing PC development... MechWarrior Online being another title using it that a lot of people are interested in!

[Warsaw]

I would have pledged when I first heard that Chris Roberts was back and working on a new project, but I'm totally out of money.

If anybody ever needed proof that gaming is better on the PC, this is it.

[Amit]

I saw this as soon as the trailer was out. Gawked at its awesomeness and promptly closed my jaw because I have no way to pay for something that awesome. I knew that was CryEngine 3 by the fluidity of the FP motion and the depth of the graphics.

[Cortexian]

It's $35 shipped to get the game and some bonuses like testing access, and you have 30 days before the pledges are going to be cut.





The finished game for your PC with your RSI Aurora spaceship ready to fly
Exclusive access to the Alpha and Beta
1,000 credits

White Citizens Card (shipping within the US free, add $5 for international - Delivery Est: Xmas 2012)
Title: Scout
Delivery Est: Nov 2014

$30 for the pledge/game and $5 for shipping. There's no subscription to the game and it's not Free2Play or Pay2Win either:

Not a subscription but not free-to-play; rather a hybrid of these two business models. Much like ArenaNet's Guild Wars 2, you will purchase the PC game and pay no recurring subscription charges. Your purchase of the game will allow you to play in the universe for free, forever! The game will offer a variety of virtual items for purchase with in-game credits allowing you to spend money on items that offer more ways to express yourself, provide convenience, and customize your experience. But the cardinal rule regarding "in-game purchases" is: Players who spend money purchasing in-game credits will have no advantage over players who spend time!

Everything is bought with in-game credits. These purchases won't offer any advantage over someone who puts in the "game-time" to earn the same amount of credits. You might ask, why have "in-game" purchases at all? This allows us the resources to support the game on an ongoing basis as well as continually add content.

[Amit]

So how much will the game be after launch? And what are credits?

[Cortexian]

I just edited my last post a bit, credits are the in-game currency that everything in-game is payed for with. You earn it either by playing (time expenditure) or by buying convenience items that make it easier to earn credits ($$$ expenditure). It's not a Pay2Win since you can't directly buy things with money, only things that let you earn credits quicker apparently.

[Cortexian]

Actually guys, I have to make a request I guess.

PLEASE spread this to your friends and onto any social media sources you have. For the love of PC gaming, this game needs to succeed. It's being developed EXCLUSIVELY for the PC with no plans for console, and that's going to put it in a lot of bad books. It's going to need all the publicity it can get and all the support to go with it. If this game succeeds it's very possible that other developers for PC will jump on the train with exclusive PC games again.

This could be the game that puts PC gaming into a new era of awesomeness. It's pushing all the pros and none of the cons of the system, and it's catering to TONS of people with TONS of different methods of play (such as HOTUS, TrackIR, Oculus Rift, controllers, etc).

[Kornman00]

It's being developed EXCLUSIVELY for the PC with no plans for console, and that's going to put it in a lot of bad books.
How? There are still plenty of PC-only games on the market

[Cortexian]

Not really good ones like we used to have.

All the really good ideas are now marketed towards consoles because publishers think that's where the money is. They're not wrong, but only because most people are to dumb or lazy to build and maintain a gaming PC. Let alone understand why it's better.

[Pooky]

Not really good ones like we used to have.

All the really good ideas are now marketed towards consoles because publishers think that's where the money is. They're not wrong, but only because most people are to dumb or lazy to build and maintain a gaming PC. Let alone understand why it's better.

Most people don't have the money to drop on a high end gaming PC. You could argue that PC gaming is cheaper in the long run, but the up front cost is too much for most. Plus PCs have a lot of problems consoles don't typically have. It's almost always too much to ask for a PC game to just work without any hassle.

[Warsaw]

It's less costly up-front, too.

Instead of spending money on both a PC to go onto the interwebs/do office work with AND a console AND its affiliated hardware and subscriptions, just buy a better PC to do it all.

"But I prefer teh controll0rz and teh big TV."

Good news, they both work with the PC.

"But installations and updates!"

No worse than consoles these days, and at least you don't have ads on your desktop.

This is CE3, it will probably scale down to mid-range hardware pretty well, and a high-end system can be built for around $600-$700. This game will be releasing right when new consoles should be appearing. Assuming it's good, that puts this game in a position to leverage itself against people contemplating buying a new console...buy a new console or buy a PC to play Star Citizen?

That all said, this game is really niche. It's the type of game that *I* am a fan of. Stylized bullshit cartoons with simple and endearing mechanics can go to fucking hell, because I want my serious, in-depth, and detailed games with the most gorgeous realistic aesthetics you can get. I've been seriously deprived of my gaming joy, and I don't want this one to slip away.

[Cortexian]

The initial cost is higher by about $300 if you want a decent starting system instead of the cheapest you could possibly go. But the experience is definitely worth that extra $300.

Edit:

Console setup:
250GB Xbox 360 - $300
Extra Controller - $60
40" Samsung LED/LCD TV - $550
Total: $910

This is far from ideal as well, it's not a complete home theater. You can't watch blu-ray movies on it, and your speakers are just TV speakers. If you add a blu-ray player, A/V amplifier, and speakers you're looking at around $2,000. The extra controller is fairly common as well, I don't know ANYONE with only one console controller. You always need an extra for friends and stuff.

PC Setup:
Bitfenix Prodigy Mini iTX Case w/ USB 3.0, Midnight Black - $79.99
Intel Core™ i5-3450 Processor, 3.10GHz w/ 6MB Cache - $179.99
Corsair Hydro H60 High Performance CPU Cooler - $74.99
Asus P8H61-I w/ DDR3 1333, 7.1 Audio, Gigabit Lan, PCI-E x16 - $74.99
Corsair Vengeance 8GB DDR3 1600MHz CL9 Dual Channel Kit (2 x 4GB) - $49.99
WD 500GB Caviar Black 7200rpm SATA III 32MB Cache Hard Drive - $89.99
LG CH12 Super Multi Blue 12x Internal SATA Blu-ray Disc Reader / Combo Drive, Black w/ Lightscribe - $69.99
eVGA GeForce GTX 660 Ti 2GB PCI-E w/ Dual DVI, HDMI, DisplayPort - $299.99
Silverstone Strider Essential 700W Power Supply - $79.99
Sub-Total: $1,000

This is a system I recently built for a friend. It's awesome, and has way more muscle than a console. It's also a Mini-ITX case and it's extremely portable, much like a console. He wanted it that way so he and I could attend LAN parties and stuff together, or even just bring it over here easily if we wanted to play some games together for a day or a weekend.

Add some peripherals:
LG E2442TC-BN 23.6in Widescreen LED LCD, Black - $189.99
Logitech H360 USB Headset, Black - $49.99
Sub-Total: $240

Total: $1,240

I left out speakers and a keyboard and mouse because if you can't find some basic ones for cheap or free from a friend, then you need friends that hoard more things. You can probably find someone to assemble this little guy for you for free as well. I know that working with a Mini-ITX system is something a lot of system builders rarely get to do and would probably jump at the opportunity.

Price difference: $330

What do you get for that $330? A blu-ray player, a much higher power GPU and water cooled CPU, quality components that won't overheat or RROD/fail, etc... You get more because you pay for more. You add in a Blu-ray player ($70) so you can at least do most of the stuff you can on the PC and now you're up to $980 and the price difference is down to $260. You could probably cheapen the PC system a bit with a less powerful PSU and GPU and bring them within spitting distance of each other. The PC would still be the better bet.

As Warsaw said, the mid-range hardware will likely run he stuff in CE3 just fine as well. You don't need a super-high performance gaming system unless you're doing super-high performance things. Things like resolutions higher than 1080p for whatever reason (multi-monitors, larger res monitors), or just wanting to max out all the game settings (which there's usually no need to do).

[Warsaw]

If you can scrounge up some parts from old PCs (if you don't have any, take a visit to a landfill some time, they actually can have some useful shit), you can lower the cost considerably.

Heaven forbid American fat-asses have to put some thought into their lives to get the most of them.

[Pooky]

Most people already have a TV. And yes, getting a console home and set up requires a lot less thought put into it. This is an entertainment product we're talking about here, that sort of thing makes a difference. I know one guy who plays Xbox 360 on a TV with a painfully noticeable ~100ms lag and he doeesn't even care. That should tell you the kind of audience consoles are targeting.

e: and about building a PC, yeah that's not going to happen. 99% of people I've talked to don't know what a PCI-Express slot is.

double e: a lot of it probably has to do with marketing too. Cause if there are ~$500 pre-built gaming PCs floating around out there, I've sure never heard of them. Whereas I see Xbox 360 ads all the damn time.

[Btcc22]

Intel Core™ i5-3450 Processor, 3.10GHz w/ 6MB Cache - $179.99
Corsair Hydro H60 High Performance CPU Cooler - $74.99
Asus P8H61-I w/ DDR3 1333
Corsair Vengeance 8GB DDR3 1600MHz


You could make quick a few savings with this build. Ditch the H60 as there's no need for it unless you're going for an unlocked CPU for overclocking, get cheaper RAM that won't be wasted on that motherboard and go for a ~500w PSU instead.

[Cortexian]

You could make quick a few savings with this build. Ditch the H60 as there's no need for it unless you're going for an unlocked CPU for overclocking, get cheaper RAM that won't be wasted on that motherboard and go for a ~500w PSU instead.
Yeah I already mentioned that you could save money a few ways in the build. This build is actually based on an unlocked build that I made for a friend, that's why the H60 is in there. You're absolutely right though, you could take it out for this processor. The RAM I selected is already pretty cheap by my standards, I wouldn't go slower than CL9/1600MHz for ANY build. I also already mentioned a less powerful PSU.

@Pooky, most people I know also already own a monitor for a PC. Feel free to aid my side and just cut the new monitor cost out of the PC price as well. Most people also have earbuds or something for an iPod, go ahead and cut the headphones out as well!

I'm assuming you're getting into gaming properly and just just putting a mismatched system together or adding a game console to a tube TV.

[Amit]

This entire page should be deleted.

[Pooky]

Yeah, probably. The funny part is, PC has always been my primary gaming platform. Certain people just get really mad when I suggest that it might not be absolutely perfect.

[Amit]

Certain people just get really mad when I suggest that it might not be absolutely perfect.

I'm guilty of this, myself.

[Cortexian]

It has its disadvantages, but usually they're obscure and irrelevant. At least in my case, I've never had issues using a PC to complete all the tasks I need it to.

[Warsaw]

I like how the carrier is a modern interpretation of the original Tiger's Claw, how the Confed (fuck you, they are) fighters are literally Hornets, how the ID codes for the enemy flashing on the bridge displays were Kilrathi text, and how the Barbarian fighters were re-imaginings of classic Kilrathi vessels.

So much nostalgia...

[rossmum]

I grabbed the Wingnut $125 pledge.
hoping my birthday will result in enough expendable to do the same. whatup.

[Cortexian]

hoping my birthday will result in enough expendable to do the same. whatup.
I almost, ALMOST convinced myself to buy the $250 pledge... But $250 is a lot without knowing what the RSI Constellation ship is. If it's a carrier or battleship then I may fork out the money.

[Warsaw]

You honestly should have gotten the Lancer package...just for the sheer narminess of it.

[Cortexian]

Never actually crossed my mind, xD...

Would of been funny to see the "Freelancer: Cortexian" as my handle in-game. Alas the pledge is made and I think the Wingnut combat ship is more the flavor of ship I'd like anyway. The Freelancer ship is geared more towards exploration and trading.

[rossmum]

I almost, ALMOST convinced myself to buy the $250 pledge... But $250 is a lot without knowing what the RSI Constellation ship is. If it's a carrier or battleship then I may fork out the money.
i'd do it in a heartbeat if i had money

i'm a sucker for little babby model ships

[Warsaw]

Never actually crossed my mind, xD...

Would of been funny to see the "Freelancer: Cortexian" as my handle in-game. Alas the pledge is made and I think the Wingnut combat ship is more the flavor of ship I'd like anyway. The Freelancer ship is geared more towards exploration and trading.

The ship you get with Wingnut is the green one you saw in the trailer, the Hornet. I've never liked that one, not even when it debuted in the original Wing Commander. Actually, I'm not much of a fan of the WCI and II designs, the ones from WC III and Prophecy were much, much better.

[Cortexian]

The ship you get with Wingnut is the green one you saw in the trailer, the Hornet. I've never liked that one, not even when it debuted in the original Wing Commander. Actually, I'm not much of a fan of the WCI and II designs, the ones from WC III and Prophecy were much, much better.
I know, I liked the Hornet.

[Warsaw]

I want a Thunderbolt VII...

[Cortexian]

More posts and excitement in this thread please.

A good PC game deserves more awesomeness. Also they're at:
Goal: $2,000,000
Raised: $1,210,152
Space Sim Fans: 13,432

And they started a Kickstarter that works in parallel with their own crowd-funding source that has raised:
7,188 Backers
$318,793 pledged of $500,000 goal

So total they're at around $1,500,000 / $2,000,000 already and they're only like 10 days in to crowd funding.

[Limited]

I heard (uncomfirmed) the total budget was $14 milliion.

I threw down some serious cash for my gaming pc, this is the type of game I bought it for, big, open, beautiful graphics, its just a shame I'm not totally into space games, that said I will pledge a bit for the game ^_^

[Cortexian]

They wanted $2 million crowd-funding in order to secure big private funders. They also have plans for "stretch goals" for any extra money they earn from crowd funding.

[Warsaw]

I heard (uncomfirmed) the total budget was $14 milliion.

I threw down some serious cash for my gaming pc, this is the type of game I bought it for, big, open, beautiful graphics, its just a shame I'm not totally into space games, that said I will pledge a bit for the game ^_^

One of the biggest draws to Star Citizen is that if it is successful, it could cause the big names in the industry to question their current methods of thinking and models of development.

:)

[n00b1n8R]

Is the citizen card a physical installer or is it just a piece of plastic? I want a physical copy of the game but there's no way I'm paying $125 for it :v:

[Cortexian]

The citizen card is just some fluff item (kinda like a drivers license, except for a fictional space universe) that they're going to send out around December 2012. Every copy of the game you purchase ($30 and higher pledge) gets you a physical copy of the game. The versions with the little spaceship USB include the game on the USB instead of a regular disk I think.

[n00b1n8R]

Oh cool.
I assume you can change your address somewhere? I doubt I'm going to be living here in 2 years when this vaporware ships.

[Cortexian]

I'm sure you can, worse case scenario you can send them an email on the main site. Click the question mark in the bottom right corner of:
http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/

[Cortexian]

So they've hit the $2,000,000 goal, as well as the $2,500,000 stretch goal so far. They are rapidly approaching the $3,000,000 stretch goal. Not sure what I'm talking about? Stretch goals are extra content that they've promised to the pledgers if "x amount of pledges are made". Here's a brief look at them:
http://i.imgur.com/XzpsK.jpg

If you haven't yet pledged and you're even vaguely interested, help the existing pledgers out by clicking here (http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/star-citizen/?rid=28463) and selecting your desired pledge amount. Details on what is included in each pledge can also be found on that page.

[rossmum]

Ugh. I honestly hate crowd funding.

I mean, yeah, people post up good ideas I like, so I foot part of the bill to make those happen - that's a sound enough concept. What's not so sound is that if it ends up not being what I hoped, I am stuck with it with no way to back out and no hope of making that money back. I have been burned several times now from preordering games and have more or less sworn off ever preordering anything ever again, regardless of how good it looks; this is about the fourth or fifth thing I've put money towards without it even being in development at time of payment.

Last time, I think.

[Cortexian]

There have already been a couple of things that seemed to be hyped up to be something they weren't. I wasn't satisfied, but when I searched around their forums I found I wasn't alone and that the devs had already clarified what was what. That at least made me happy, and the more clear answers from the team were satisfactory even if they weren't the ideal thing I was looking for.

[neuro]

there's actually a slim chance i might end up working on this.

Eternal Silence ring a bell anyone?

[Cortexian]

That would be awesome neuro!

FYI, they've added a referral system, see the news update here (http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/star-citizen-get-out-the-pledge/). Chris himself said that if you want, you will be able to retroactively designate someone who referred you (http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/3-million-update-from-chris-roberts/) in the "Your Account" page on their website.

[Cortexian]

Come on dudes! Lets tell everyone we know and push to $4 million for some professional modding tools! They het $3.5 Million last night, new star systems every $100,000 and we're going to get another flyable ship when the game launches at $3.7 Million!

http://i.imgur.com/lQAK0.jpg

[Warsaw]

I'm actually looking at that "outside-the-ship combat" bullet...hmmm...

[Cortexian]

Well they're already going to be adding the ability to board other ships. They have to be multi-crew ships, basically unless there's room to walk around in the ship you can't board it. However you need to shoot out the enemies weapons and thrusters, then use a potentially expensive tractor beam and docking collar. It's more of a reward for awesome shooting than a main feature. Boarding will be done in FPS mode with guns and the like, defenders can setup turrets and stuff while the attackers are cutting through the hatch.

There was also some mention of being able to exit your ship and do the whole EVA shooter thing. But I believe you're right, that's at the $4 million mark.

[Cortexian]

So both the things we wanted have been attained Warsaw, they're sitting at $5.1 Million right now and pledges are POURING in at the last minute. The previous highest crowdfunded game was $4.2 Million, so Star Citizen is now the highest crowdfunded game ever... Wow!

That lone makes me want to upgrade my pledge from $125 to $250 lol.

[Zeph]

there's actually a slim chance i might end up working on this.

Eternal Silence ring a bell anyone?
I wondered what this guy was going to do about jobs when this thing kicked off. I know he's got contacts to fill major roles, but I wondered if he was going to open up jobs if he hit hella stretch goals. Well, he did.

[Warsaw]

So both the things we wanted have been attained Warsaw, they're sitting at $5.1 Million right now and pledges are POURING in at the last minute. The previous highest crowdfunded game was $4.2 Million, so Star Citizen is now the highest crowdfunded game ever... Wow!

That lone makes me want to upgrade my pledge from $125 to $250 lol.

I only wish I could have pledged. :c

I hope somebody does a BSG-style mod for this game in the future. Doesn't have to be BSG, but the muffled-sound, bullets-in-space, and BSG flight physics make for a very visceral game. Diaspora has proven that much. I hope Chris Roberts and company don't do the whole "pew pew pew lasers" thing again.

[Cortexian]

I'm pretty sure they mentioned something about having different sound modes. I thought they were saying there would be a semi-realistic sound mode as well.

[Warsaw]

It's not just the sounds, it's how things behave. I don't want to see space ships blasting at each other with slow-moving, slow-firing energy cannons. I'd rather them do something like the Impulse Ray Emitters from X3, or detonating flak and huge 16-inch cannons...

Have you played the first release of Diaspora?

[Cortexian]

Well they said they're going to sacrifice some visual realism for a more cinematic experience. Lasers will be "bolts", though they're going to be fairly fast. I'd assume projectiles will have some type of tracer effect and missiles will have contrails.

And no I haven't played that.

[Warsaw]

You ought to. It's free, you have nothing to lose but time. If you enjoy space combat sims, Diaspora demonstrates an alternative combat style to what we're used to, and the visual effect is stunning.

[Cortexian]

So they've almost hit $7 million in funding now, even after official pledging closed... Wow.

[Warsaw]

So we're getting everything and the kitchen sink? Awesome. They better deliver, or there are going to be some lawsuits.

[Zeph]

Yeah, for this, they could probably keep funding open to launch and work out something like what Notch did with Minecraft by raising the amount (minimum amount in this case) as it nears launch.

[Cortexian]

Well, the minimum amount they needed to fund was 2 million. Their maximum goal was 6 million, that they attained within the funding period (6.25 million or something). Now they're at 6.98 million, though everyone who pledged after the funding closed doesn't get all the same benefits.

[=sw=warlord]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrQ0qMRZ_1Q

[Btcc22]

I've been following this game pretty closely but I'm pretty put off by the pay to win aspects, despite what the fanboys (paying hundreds for ships for a game that doesn't yet exist) and Chris Roberts espouse.

Most of those arguing that it won't be seem to live in some fantasy land where clearly you have time or money but never both or neither, therefore making everything perfectly balanced. Either that or they're redefined 'pay to win' so it doesn't apply to any game where you can acquire the same goods without paying, regardless of how much of a time sink it is. :allears:

Perhaps it'll all work out though. Time will tell.

[Cortexian]

I don't classify a game as pay 2 win if I can put the time into playing it to earn something. If you don't have the time to sit down and sink into a video game that has you interested, it clearly doesn't have you interested enough or you're not a true gamer™

[Warsaw]

Honestly? X: Rebirth is looking more promising right now. Star Citizen is basically a vapourware pipe-dream and I'm not sure they can pull it off. Roberts's idea of what makes a game fun might still be stuck in the 90s for all I know.

[Btcc22]

I don't classify a game as pay 2 win if I can put the time into playing it to earn something.

What if it takes you 100,000 hours to earn the same items? Still going to stick to that definition?

[Skyline]

Can you say it's pay to win when you can only pay for items as rewards for supporting their development funds ? I believe the only items they said you can buy in-game (when the game gets released) are ship design plans which are ships designed by community members and the money goes to them. You then have to play the game and gather in-game resources to actually build the ship.

[Zeph]

Honestly? X: Rebirth is looking more promising right now. Star Citizen is basically a vapourware pipe-dream and I'm not sure they can pull it off. Roberts's idea of what makes a game fun might still be stuck in the 90s for all I know.

Are you suggesting things become less fun as time progresses? The Halo series kept getting progressively less fun (ODST excluded as that brought something completely new to the table) as time progressed, but that didn't make the original Halo any less fun. It has less eye candy than its sequels, but eye candy is far from what makes a game fun.

If you think something has to be new and fresh in order to be fun, most sports and the Olympics would like to have a word with you.


Can you say it's pay to win when you can only pay for items as rewards for supporting their development funds ? I believe the only items they said you can buy in-game (when the game gets released) are ship design plans which are ships designed by community members and the money goes to them. You then have to play the game and gather in-game resources to actually build the ship.
That all depends on how those design plans (I'll call them blueprints) are implemented.
If they're able to build an infinite amount of ships off those blueprints that are only able to be obtained through crowdfunding then it might as well be pay to win if that ship is unique and superior in stats to others in the game. This would give those crowdfunded owners the opportunity to dictate prices of a truly unique item by restricting supply. A similar mechanism existed in EVE with t2 blueprint originals (unlimited production). As the sole provider of a type of ship, they were able to dictate prices and were truly the richest people in the game. They were so rich they were able to convince owners of other t2 blueprint originals to sell them for multiple years of revenue just to further constrict the market and ensure their income.

It caused an outrage amongst the players and the devs implemented a way to invent blueprint copies (limited run of production) for t2 items. It took nearly five years for things to balance themselves and for the market to be corrected. I'd argue it only took that short amount of time because the people doing invention valued their time at zero and used that as their profit margin. Most of the invention runs created a negative value on the ships being invented so anyone building off those invention stats lost money (probably without realizing it).


If they're only able to build one then it is not pay to win as long as that ship is destructible and able to be lost forever.
If the ship is identical in stats to other ships but merely aesthetically different,then it's not pay to win.

[Skyline]

Those blueprints are available to everyone though, that's a system they plan to implement. The rewards are just a single ship and if they are destroyed they are lost forever. The exception are those that gave donations during the first 30 days of funding, they have a lifetime insurance policy on the ship though they clearly stated it can't be abused in such the way you just kamikaze the ship and spawn a new one. Every time you use the insurance the cooldown until you can get your ship again increases. As far as I know all the ships that are being given to people donating are not unique in any way and anyone can get them in-game.

[Warsaw]

Are you suggesting things become less fun as time progresses? The Halo series kept getting progressively less fun (ODST excluded as that brought something completely new to the table) as time progressed, but that didn't make the original Halo any less fun. It has less eye candy than its sequels, but eye candy is far from what makes a game fun.

If you think something has to be new and fresh in order to be fun, most sports and the Olympics would like to have a word with you.

What I mean is that while replaying the Wing Commander series is fun, it's fun because I grew up with it and reliving the memories is something I like to do. The play mechanics do not, however, hold up very well today. The combat is monotonous and extremely repetitive with no real challenge offered beyond having to mash "E" constantly to decoy enemy missiles on higher difficulties. What I don't want from Star Citizen is Wing Commander: 2014 Edition, because that would not be fun. What I fear is that Roberts will be delivering exactly that, but with some added insubstantial fluff...such as eye candy. Or walking around inside the capital ships.

Remember, Roberts has not actually made a game since Starlancer (2000). Freelancer doesn't count because he left his position early on and was merely an advisor on the project.

[Cortexian]

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/star-citizen-hanger-module,24065.html

[Amit]

I don't know what's happening to me. Despite having no interest in Star Citizen up to this point, an hour ago I started having a panic attack about being too late to get in on the pledge packages. I've since found out that there's plenty of time left for that, though. What I need help with is choosing the right package for my budget. $50 is what I'm willing to spend and the closest packages are the Scout and Mercenary for $30 and $40 respectively.

From what I can see, Merc and Scout are identical packages except the Scout doesn't get alpha/beta access and it has one month less insurance. I'm leaning towards the merc package, but I want to know how long the Alpha + Beta periods are likely to be. How long will I be waiting to access the full game if I go for scout instead? I also want the Origin 300i instead of the Aurora, but I'm not willing to spend $65USD to get it :(

[Btcc22]

For what it's worth, if it doesn't end up being pay to win, you won't have a problem acquiring those ships through play.

[Amit]

That's true. And it's not going to be P2W. Only thing you can purchase is in-game currency and there's a cap on how much you can purchase per month.

[Amit]

Went ahead and bought the Mercenary package. 25 minutes until the Hangar module is done downloading.

[Cortexian]

Yeah the Hanger is kinda neat. I can't wait for the Dog Fighting module though, or even just something to let me practice flying!

[Amit]

Awesome in-engine Aurora commercial:


http://vimeo.com/76735257

[Warsaw]

Here's some more interesting news. (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/contest/the-next-great-starship)

Anybody want to do this? I'm already drawing up starships...

[Zeph]

I thought about it, but then I remembered how many jobless specialists this field has made.

[Dwood]

you are already jobless though, zeph.

[Zeph]

emphasis on the specialist part.

people who focus on one thing really well is what they're looking for with the way this is set up.

i expect every team that passes into the proper contest to consist of one technical artist, one hard surface specialist, and a 3d artist that can draw.

[Warsaw]

Probably.

That said, with all the mods out there and all the digital media I've seen, I can tell you that the vast majority lack decisive aesthetic conviction. There is a reason there are a few big names on the likes of dA, etc. that are familiar (i.e. Adam Burn). And I've seen very few mods for space games with great looking content that wasn't a mere conversion of another existing universe's content to the game. I suspect that the finalists are going to be clean ideas with a clear aesthetic theme, probably existing back-stories, and a minimum of greeble. In the end, the preliminary challenge (designing that wave particle cannon) will probably be more interesting to watch than the ships themselves, since it enforces constraints.

[Zeph]

Yeah, it's kinda why I avoid polycount forums. There are definitely some talented people out there, but they're one in a million to the chest thumpers who know what they're talking about because they've read some other people say the same thing or that they've sat through a proper critique themselves. Usually the chest thumpers ride on other people's ideas or pursue their own individual idea of aesthetics when approaching your own personal work.

I've actually run into this issue with the game I've been working on. Space-based science fiction is relatively limited in what you can do with it aesthetically. Symmetry, asymmetry, blocky, organic, etc. There's only so far you can go in those regards before you lose visual interest in the piece, it becomes too noisy/bland, or you begin to roughly encroach on another IPs designs and you look like a leacher. Look at Gundam. The mecha designs were very straightforward, but you rarely see anything come close to them (closest I can think of is later-gen FMP). By staying away from that general area of design, it makes virtually all other mecha look the same in comparison.

The one thing I look forward to during the proper contest is how well the artists listen to exactly to what CIG people say then refines particular points of interest versus the two or three teams take what CIG says and scraps->overhauls with new ideas.

[Warsaw]

The problem with mecha, apart from being 100% impractical, is that the Japanese are largely convinced they all have to look like giant people in suits of techy samurai armour. Look at the mecha in GitS: absolutely nothing like Gundam or most any other anime's mecha. Blue Gender also has its own unique interpretation with its Armour Shrike variation. Both series are very worth watching (if you can get over the cringe-tastic hair of the latter's male protagonist). Then there are also the Western interpretations of mecha: the walkers from the Battlezone series of games are quite unique, as are those found in Hawken and Mech Warrior. Even the humanoid mecha of the Heavy Gear series are quite different looking.

Science-fiction can be every bit as interesting as fantasy, or reality, etc. I mean, if you want to get right down to it, everything is either blocky, curvaceous, or some combination of the two. Accepting that most sci-fi is actually science-fantasy, science fiction is limited compared to straight fantasy only in that you need to have proper justification (physical, political, economic, whatever) for everything and you must minimize the use of "because magic." I can't really comment on work ethic when making a piece, since mine is terrible, but I can say that if your (general "your") artistic vision is getting too diluted it's time to stop, pick out the key points, and start again from there. I've probably gone through that process three or four times now, and I finally think I've got something unique enough to call mine.

I suspect that the teams which refine their original idea will do better, since they have the conviction to see it through to the end and can effectively use the criticism. Those who constantly come up with something new will get new problems every time, and can't actually progress anywhere without excessive brute-force skill. That said, I don't put much stock in CIG crit since I don't actually like the general aesthetic of Star Citizen so far. The star ships are going back to those awkward Wing Commander I proportions, are covered in useless detail, and sport profiles that just don't make any sense in space or militarily; "rule of cool" doesn't hold much sway with me. That said, it's their game and I can get over my preferences enough to play it when it comes out.

P.S. The Cutlass is basically a human interpretation of a Minbari Flyer from Babylon 5:
3254

[Cortexian]

Just something I was able to make...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNzElVfocJQ

[Dwood]

I am suddenly interested in the development of this game. ill be paying more attention to it from here on out.

[Amit]

Just something I was able to make...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNzElVfocJQ

So you bought all of the ships?

[Cortexian]

No I don't have $15,000 to spend on a video game. That's how much this would cost at the minimum. It would actually cost more since the package I got this in has more than the $15,000 one.

I do get perks through work though!

[Amit]

Ah, that makes way more sense now lol. I was like where the fuck did this guy get enough money to buy all the pre-order ships and then get an XCR-M on top of that.

[Cortexian]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0gZES2pTWk

If you have a 4k display, this video is available in 4k. Select the "Original" quality option above 1080p to enable it. We downloaded it and added it to our Samsung 4k demo TV's playlist of 4k content at work and it looks stunning.

[=sw=warlord]

Yep, that's the ship I've dived on.
I've been tweaking some of the weapon placements and the turret isn't implemented just yet but this game does have my attention now.
http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n599/cobby87/StarCitizen2013-10-2715-38-05-61_zps9ea3e56d.jpg

[Warsaw]

Anybody using an Aurora to actively try and take down a dedicated combat vessel is a fucking idiot.

On a separate note, I sincerely hope that all of these weapon effects are just placeholders, because they are lame. Seriously lame.

[Btcc22]

Anybody using an Aurora to actively try and take down a dedicated combat vessel is a fucking idiot.

My word. The game isn't even out yet.

[Dwood]

My word. The game isn't even out yet.

this is modacity. we play games before they are even out.

[Warsaw]

I'm making the comment as a viewer within the universe, not a gamer waiting to play the game. CIG said the Aurora is basically the Ford F150 of space, not a fighter. If you want to make a convincing in-universe advertisement showing how superior your super sports-car is to everybody else's, you don't show it taking on the everyman's pick-up truck.

[Cortexian]

Yep, that's the ship I've dived on.
I've been tweaking some of the weapon placements and the turret isn't implemented just yet but this game does have my attention now.
You know that the ball turret won't come with the F7C base model right? It has the cargo module instead. The Hornet's that we can pledge for aren't the military versions we saw in the Squadron 42 trailer with the canard and ball turrets. We will be able to buy these in-game after the fact, alternatively the F7C-M Super Hornet that you can now pledge for/upgrade to has the ball turret attached. It's a two-seater variant though, unlike the military one-seater that presumably has a much better targeting/AI suite controlling the ball turret.

[=sw=warlord]

Are you certain about that?
http://i1141.photobucket.com/albums/n599/cobby87/StarCitizen2013-10-2806-46-05-84_zps54a9f6ea.jpg

[Cortexian]

Yes, that's a two-seater F7C-M Super Hornet.

[Amit]

drools​

[NullZero]

I went and got the $30 starter, so my hangar looks very unimpressive compared to yours FL, holyshit that looks nice. I've always wanted a space game where I can actually move my character around in hangars or space stations in general. Moving around in big super motherships would be impressive too. Easier said than done though.

[Zeph]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0gZES2pTWk

If you have a 4k display, this video is available in 4k. Select the "Original" quality option above 1080p to enable it. We downloaded it and added it to our Samsung 4k demo TV's playlist of 4k content at work and it looks stunning.

I'm not entirely sure which is more impressive:
That this has rift support.
Look position from the rift can be serialized.


They've made a game where you can see where your copilot is looking incredibly accurately.
Only thing they need now is an add-on to the rift where you can point with your finger in real space and have it accurately represented as a vector in the simulation.

[Amit]

I literally gasped when I saw this:

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/media/d8ktckex1ucmrr/source/Banu3.jpg

$250USD

[Warsaw]

nope.avi

Come on Chris, what happened to those nicely utilitarian ships in Wing Commander III?

[TeeKup]

I LIKE IT.

I'll take 20.

[Rainbow Dash]

come take on my two idrises motherfuckers

i double dare u

[EX12693]

I finally decided to get this. Got the basic Aurora LN package.

[Cortexian]

come take on my two idrises motherfuckers

i double dare u
Hope you have friends and some way to recouperte the $2,500 you spent on two virtual space ships!.

I have an F7C-M Super Hornet, Freelancer, Constellation, and Retaliator now... I've donated to much.


I literally gasped when I saw this:

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/media/d8ktckex1ucmrr/source/Banu3.jpg

$250USD
Don't go stating that it's $250 USD. That's just the pledge price, all prices are "inflated" right now because they're still in crowd-funding mode. When the game comes out the costs will come waaaaay down.


nope.avi

Come on Chris, what happened to those nicely utilitarian ships in Wing Commander III?
That's a Banu (alien) ship design. Pretty much all of the human ships are darn utilitarian. I'm interesting to see how the pull off the Origin 890 JUMP super-yacht... It's supposed to be a player obtainable, multi-level luxury yacht that can still somehow be spec'd out for certain non-combat oriented things.

[Rainbow Dash]

Hope you have friends and some way to recouperte the $2,500 you spent on two virtual space ships!.


stfu poor peasant boy

[Warsaw]

Hope you have friends and some way to recouperte the $2,500 you spent on two virtual space ships!.

I have an F7C-M Super Hornet, Freelancer, Constellation, and Retaliator now... I've donated to much.


Don't go stating that it's $250 USD. That's just the pledge price, all prices are "inflated" right now because they're still in crowd-funding mode. When the game comes out the costs will come waaaaay down.


That's a Banu (alien) ship design. Pretty much all of the human ships are darn utilitarian. I'm interesting to see how the pull off the Origin 890 JUMP super-yacht... It's supposed to be a player obtainable, multi-level luxury yacht that can still somehow be spec'd out for certain non-combat oriented things.

In that case, awesome but useless to me. My intent with this game is to spend all my time blowing things up. Maybe I'll be a mercenary!

[Cortexian]

stfu poor peasant boy
I have access to every ship (announced and unannounced), and I spent nothing. Hope you had fun over paying!

I've also spend over $1,000 on stuff for my personal account. Almost bought an Idris but I don't have a large enough group of friends willing to schedule play times and man the thing to justify it. If that changes we can always work together as a fleet wit hour smaller ships to earn the Idris in-game.

[Amit]

Don't go stating that it's $250 USD. That's just the pledge price, all prices are "inflated" right now because they're still in crowd-funding mode. When the game comes out the costs will come waaaaay down.

...


Hope you have friends and some way to recouperte the $2,500 you spent on two virtual space ships!.

:lol:

I'll state what I damn well please. The pledge price is $250USD. You are buying an item. The price after release does not change that.



Almost bought an Idris but I don't have a large enough group of friends willing to schedule play times and man the thing to justify it. If that changes we can always work together as a fleet wit hour smaller ships to earn the Idris in-game.

That's what sucks. I don't know enough people who would have a schedule that fits with my own to play with a ship of that size.

[Rainbow Dash]

I have access to every ship (announced and unannounced), and I spent nothing. Hope you had fun over paying!

i have access to two idrises and i haven't spent anything either

have fun getting dunked on peasant

[Cortexian]

Cool, but my package was completely free. No one paid for it, sorry for your lots.


I'll state what I damn well please. The pledge price is $250USD. You are buying an item. The price after release does not change that.
Wrong.

I'm contributing $250 to help fund the game development, and they are gifting me a ship for my generosity.

[Rainbow Dash]

Cool, but my package was completely free. No one paid for it, sorry for your lots.


Wrong.

I'm contributing $250 to help fund the game development, and they are gifting me a ship for my generosity.

you sound like a really jealous scrub

get good nerd

[=sw=warlord]

Wrong.

I'm contributing $250 to help fund the game development, and they are gifting me a ship for my generosity.
Which is effectively a round bout way of saying "I'm paying them XXX amount of currency and in return I receive X item.
Last I looked that was called a transaction, you are buying access to the game and access to the ship.

[Cortexian]

you sound like a really jealous scrub

get good nerd
I just checked, I have both the Idris-P and Idris-M in the package they credited me. Can't be jealous of someone who paid for them I guess...


Which is effectively a round bout way of saying "I'm paying them XXX amount of currency and in return I receive X item.
Last I looked that was called a transaction, you are buying access to the game and access to the ship.
Don't be absurd! The $250 Retaliator packages don't come with game access! You only get a ship.

Chris Roberts himself has said that you are NOT BUYING SHIPS with these pledges. You are donating money to the game development, and in turn for your support they are freely rewarding you with ships. He has said that unlike most crowdfunding campaigns which usually offer additional physical rewards as "perks", he would rather reward people with ships in the game because there's no cost (with the exception of ship development cost, which has easily been covered already). That means more money towards game development as a whole.

You guys can call them purchases and transactions all you want, but I don't see it that way. I'm donating the money to donate the money, not buy a ship that I could earn in-game or purchase with some kind of premium currency for probably 1/10th the cost of these pledges.

[Donut]

Good god, this thread is passive aggressive shit-post central.

[Tnnaas]

It's like every family reunion I've ever been too. :v:

[Rainbow Dash]

I just checked, I have both the Idris-P and Idris-M in the package they credited me. Can't be jealous of someone who paid for them I guess...

aww that's cute you were so angry you went to the black market and bought two idrises just because i called you a scrub

that's just adorable

[Warsaw]

What's adorable is people fighting over e-peen size, in Q4 2013, for a game that's not supposed to come out until Q1 2015. Keep it going guys, your displays of inadequacy are great fap material.

[Cortexian]

aww that's cute you were so angry you went to the black market and bought two idrises just because i called you a scrub

that's just adorable
Still wrong sorry!

v0_nXbyTyQk

[=sw=warlord]

http://www.hotline.ie/cms/images/HookLineSinker.jpg

[Btcc22]

Chris Roberts himself has said that you are NOT BUYING SHIPS with these pledges. You are donating money to the game development, and in turn for your support they are freely rewarding you with ships.

Tomato, tomato. You wouldn't be 'donating' if you weren't receiving the ships in exchange.

Reminds me of a scandal that happened over in the UK a while back. Certainly wealthy individuals making 'donations' to a political party and coincidentally receiving honours. They weren't buying them though, you understand, merely donating to their preferential party.

Regardless, supporting the game's development and buying ships aren't mutally exclusive. You're doing both.

[Higuy]

hey guys, lets waste money on fictional video game star ships

as btcc22 would say:

http://forums.watchuseek.com/attachments/f17/562392d1321919962-ebay-mrg-8100-rip-off-alert-now-7600-bad_lenders1.jpg

[Cortexian]

Tomato, tomato. You wouldn't be 'donating' if you weren't receiving the ships in exchange.
Yes I would, I really want this game to happen and I've determined that I'll be donating $1000~ to its development. Give or take a couple hundred depending on if new ships come out and I melt my packages for different ones, etc.


hey guys, lets waste money on fictional video game star ships
Waste is a totally incorrect term? None of it is being wasted (hopefully), it's all being used towards game development. The $34,000,000 that they have now is in AAA budget territory, so as long as we get a AAA quality game everyone will be happy.

[Rainbow Dash]

Still wrong sorry!

v0_nXbyTyQk

tl;dw

you're so salty ROFL

[Amit]

I think some of you are underestimating how much Cortexian wants this game to happen. He's a huge Freelancer nutjob and would pledge large amounts to it even if he were not to receive ships in return. The difference between him and most other people that purchased the game is that we want value from our money. The main purpose I pledged money was because I was guaranteed a ship, Alpha, Beta, and Full game access for a one-time fee. Since there is guarantee to get these item in return for money we pledge, this is a proper transaction and counts as an actual cost. Words from Chris Roberts cannot change that. Now if RSI were to remove the guarantee that we'd get these things, then it would truly be a pledge because we would be doing it to show confidence in the game without fully expecting to receive everything listed.

[Rainbow Dash]

I think some of you are underestimating how much Cortexian wants this game to happen. He's a huge Freelancer nutjob and would pledge large amounts to it even if he were not to receive ships in return. The difference between him and most other people that purchased the game is that we want value from our money. The main purpose I pledged money was because I was guaranteed a ship, Alpha, Beta, and Full game access for a one-time fee. Since there is guarantee to get these item in return for money we pledge, this is a proper transaction and counts as an actual cost. Words from Chris Roberts cannot change that. Now if RSI were to remove the guarantee that we'd get these things, then it would truly be a pledge because we would be doing it to show confidence in the game without fully expecting to receive everything listed.

u mean he's so eager to get dunked on by me that he's willing to give money to a guy on the internet

aww that's so cute <3<3

[Warsaw]

Time to ruin the troll: He has a free self-updating press account in his name. If he loses a ship it's no big deal, since he can just come back with another one at no cost. You automatically have an inferior account, Sel. That said, Idrises are for plebs.

On the other matter, if one knew there was a reward for supporting the game before giving money, he bought the item. If one just donates without knowing of a reward and are given a ship post-fact, he made a donation and was rewarded for it.

[Higuy]

Waste is a totally incorrect term? None of it is being wasted (hopefully), it's all being used towards game development. The $34,000,000 that they have now is in AAA budget territory, so as long as we get a AAA quality game everyone will be happy.

yeah man because you need 34 million dollars to make a good game. it better be good if they have that kind of budget.

It's one thing to donate towards something you think is cool and care about, but on the other hand you are also essentially paying to win. Sure, developers need money to cover costs such as software licensing, but if the people you are donating too are as dedicated as you think, they probably could make a pretty nice game in CryEngine 3 without a ton of money to do so. Also note the fact of how much money they have raised and their popularity, they will be rolling in even more dough by the time it releases. Look at all the indie games that have started from nothing and have become huge successes. A game also isn't competitive when you have people paying to get new items, weapons, ships (etc). Sure, you helped finance the game, but does that mean you should be getting stuff like this to be automatically better than other people upon the games release? A game normally should be using peoples skill, not their money, when it comes to things like this, and should be fair.

Like Warsaw said, knowing what happens when you donate also makes a huge difference.

[Warsaw]

I wouldn't say it's pay to win. As far as I am aware, you can earn these ships from within the game, and I doubt PvP is the only way to do so.

[Cortexian]

Paying to have immediate access to things is not pay to win when the same ships can be had in-game for the free currency.

Keep in mind, there's gonna be player hosted dedicated servers as well that effectively replicate the persistant universe on a smaller scale (probably only limited to hardware resources). So if CIG makes the PU economy stupid then they're fucked because everyone will just migrate to the dedicated servers.

[Btcc22]

Paying to have immediate access to things is not pay to win when the same ships can be had in-game for the free currency.

That's the Chris Roberts definition but it's not one I share. Paying money to bypass the game's mechanics in my mind is pay-to-win, period.

Having such a model in place gives developers an incentive to make it difficult to obtain the items through normal play, in the hopes of players giving up and shelling out instead. If you want a good example of this, see Diablo 3's auction house or pretty much any F2P game. By your definition it could be nigh on impossible to obtain items through play but as long as there's a possibility, nope, not pay-to-win!

$34m in funding, non-F2P and it still has micro-transactions. If a player so badly wants to skip the game, why not do it on a non-official server?

It irks me somewhat that people pull out the "but I don't have time to play" argument in response to having this kind of stuff in games. What they really mean is that they don't have the patience to progress through the game and would prefer to have an insta-win button handed to them at the expense of those that can't afford it. Sure, without paying their way through the game they may never compete with the players that spend their entire waking life playing but that's okay and how it should be - not having your cake and eating it too.

You can boil the whole argument down to, "it's not fair that somebody has something I don't", but if you continue down that path you'll arrive at "but I don't have time or money". Catering to those folk wouldn't make a good business case, though.

"Why do you care?", I hear you ask. I care for the reason I've already mentioned; it encourages developers to stack the game against those that aren't willing to pay and to reserve the best content for those shelling out. For an example of the former, see Tribes Ascend. For the latter, see WoW's mount and pet shop.

[Amit]

Keep in mind, there's gonna be player hosted dedicated servers as well that effectively replicate the persistent universe on a smaller scale (probably only limited to hardware resources).

Holy shit. I did not know that.

Fixed your "persistant", btw :P

[Cortexian]

Well, keep in mind that the player hosted servers won't be AS content rich as the PU when it comes to online play. That is what will give people incentive to play there and spend money on the micro-transaction cash-shop.

I don't see it as any different than people who buy BioWare Points in Mass Effect 3 to unlock things quicker than people who just earn the normal points.

[Warsaw]

Except in Mass Effect 3 you have no idea what you're going to get when you spend money and the unlockables don't give you much, if any, advantage.

I dunno. Microtransactions in Star Citizen sounds skeevy as fuck.

[Btcc22]

Except in Mass Effect 3 you have no idea what you're going to get when you spend money and the unlockables don't give you much, if any, advantage.

Plus it's a co-op game, so who cares?

[Warsaw]

Exactly!

[Higuy]

I don't see it as any different than people who buy BioWare Points in Mass Effect 3 to unlock things quicker than people who just earn the normal points.

It's the same, but just because other games do it does not mean its a good thing? Also - who the hell plays Mass Effect just for its multiplayer?

Micro-transactions hurt the game, and the only reason they are included is because the developers know people will buy them, resulting in more cash for them. Any other reason for it is simply an excuse. People will buy them out of laziness, and once enough players have done so, it'll hurt newer players trying to start, which might even lead to more people cashing in just to get started in the game. Thats a pretty exagerated way of saying it, but its also a possibility of something happening becuase of it.

I really agree with what Btc22 has to say. Its a non F2P game, so the developers will be earning money by copies sold, they already have 34 MILLION dollars in funding, and they still want to add micro transactions. Sure they might have to pay for stuff like Software licensing and of course CryEngines royalty fee (which is around 20% for most devs if I am not mistaken, but it can differ). They have enough cash to support themselves comfortably and continue making a great game (hopefully).

[Cortexian]

How is it going to hurt new players trying to start when you can just drag your PvP slider to 0% and only ever fight NPC's?

I really don't get it?

[Higuy]

What about the people who don't want to play against mindless bots?

[EX12693]

Play against mindless bots, earn some shit, then play against players.

[Rainbow Dash]

What about the people who don't want to play against mindless bots?

Then they set their pvp slider to the complete opposite setting, or just play in nullsec where the slider will not apply at all.

[Cortexian]

Yup, the "slider" can be adjusted while you play on the PU. Want to start off getting your bearings? Go full PvE and never encounter actual players. Want some extra challenge here and there? Set the slider somewhere in the middle. Want the most realistic* and difficult experience? Then go full retard PvP mode.

Basically the slider determines if/how many players show up in your areas while you're flying around. They higher you set the PvP slider, the more likely actual players will "bleed over" into your PvE universe.

* Realistic in that you are always fighting actual people, complete with the unpredictable and unique experiences this will bring.

[Warsaw]

What I find amusing is that in any game where you can fight bots and people, the people are often no better than the bots except for when they are exploiting some game mechanic.

[Dwood]

I'm confused. what's the current multiplayer status?

[Warsaw]

Opt-in MMO with the ability to host your own small servers.

[EX12693]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFLvfERKRPg

[Cortexian]

They have a few people that have worked on MWLL actually :)

[Rainbow Dash]

i wonder if mech got hired

[EX12693]

So did anyone here submit anything for TNGS?

[Cortexian]

I started a Freelancer server running the Discovery mod... Just screwing around on there with a couple other people right now. If anyone is interested:
http://discovery.game-host.org

Until Star Citizen comes it it's kinda fun I guess.

[Btcc22]

Well, that live demo was a complete train wreck. Expecting a video highlight of the failures in 3...

[Amit]

Would love to see it.

[Btcc22]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RK3UlPb53Xs&amp;hd=1

[Zeph]

Yeah, recut because they utterly failed in their presentation.

[Btcc22]

Yeah, recut because they utterly failed in their presentation.

Yup but if you're implying that it was recut to hide that fact, hit play. ;)

[Cortexian]

Yeah, recut because they utterly failed in their presentation.
Did you expect something else? There's a reason most game studios barely ever show anything off early anymore, and its people who don't understand that what they're seeing isn't representative of a final product.

[Zeph]

Did you expect something else? There's a reason most game studios barely ever show anything off early anymore, and its people who don't understand that what they're seeing isn't representative of a final product.
Yeah, actually I did. When you're making a live presentation you have a backup in case your project fails irrecoverably. If you're showing off a website, that means a local offline copy. Networked game? Local recorded footage you can talk over to keep people in the back from leaving and going back to PAX. The idea of their show was to show what supporters could expect, not try to figure out which executable to launch and hope you can connect to your server across the country for auth and serialization. Getting connected to the server and showing a live match was a bonus. Having that shows you've put thought into what you're doing and aren't up there improving. They were supposed to have hired someone capable of doing that.

[Cortexian]

The server was running locally (there were no problems related to this), the machines they had for demo were brand new Alienware systems that they didn't have access to until the day of the demo... They had to bring an external SSD with the latest build of the dogfighting module straight from the studio to load onto said demo systems.

It wasn't a failure of planning, it was simply logistical challenges. Also, this kind of thing happens all the time at PAX and has even become commonplace at E3. Remember all the presentation fails from EA and Ubisoft at E3 last year? EA and Ubisoft have way more experience and E3 presentations are much larger and better planned and things still go wrong...

Presentations like this are becoming infinitely more complex and difficult to coordinate due to the popularization of live streaming and interactive demos instead of pre-recorded footage representing something that you'll never see in the game (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eoqGLS1U6GQ). I'd much rather see a live demo at an event than watch some boring pre-rendered nonsense, especially as early in development as Star Citizen.

TL;DR: Shit happens.

[=sw=warlord]

Funny how the Halo 2 video you linked, wasn't actually pre-recorded.
That actually has various versions of that demo floating around online seeing how it was exactly that, a demo. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ax1nvd8DF1Q)

[Dwood]

Freelancer's point still stands though. Look at the pre-recorded footage from the last ALIENS game (that they claimed was 'live'), versus the actual game that shipped.

[=sw=warlord]

Sure, let's make two games that got overhauled during development cycle as our examples of games promising to be one and ending up like another.
Halo 2's case was the programming and gameplay didn't work and Colonial marines was because a studio had crapped half the work handed to them and immediately crapped on the remains.
Gearbox was lucky top have managed to salvage what they did after what happened to that project.

[Cortexian]

Since you brought up "overhauled during development", I'll just point out that Star Citizen is so early in development still that they likely don't have a defined pipeline yet. It is constantly being "overhauled", PBR is a good example of something they're implemented post-production process of some content they had already mostly finished. However, literally everything is still being created and tweaked. I don't think any one component in the game has been "gold-locked" yet.

[Warsaw]

^ And that is why it's essentially vaporware to me. Sure, they have some playable demos for you to mess around with, but as a game it is and has nothing.

[Cortexian]

What? That arguement made sense with Hangar module, but Dogfighting is essentially all the major ship-in-space mechanics that you'll need. Once that comes out I think that's fairly solid evidence that it's actually happening.

[Amit]

To be honest, I'm still fairly optimistic about this. They have raked in over $42 million. They have too much exposure and coverage to bait and switch. Of course, depending on how they split the money, they could do that, but everyone in the industry and even outside of it will hate them. There would be so much negativity surrounding them that I doubt they would be able to do anything gaming related ever again unless they used the money they do have now to make it.

[Amit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vO7RxsZpcKc

[Dwood]

That's... Surprisingly well done, haha.

[TeeKup]

Holy shit if I had money to drop on this game.

[Amit]

Holy shit if I had money to drop on this game.

It's incredibly inexpensive to get in on this game if you get the Aurora: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge

[Cortexian]

To get in on Arena Commander immediately you need the $5.00 Arena Commander access too though. Only original backers got alpha access with their packages.

[TeeKup]

I would probably need to upgrade my rig before I got into this game either way.

[Cortexian]

So I just picked up the Redeemer gunship, wanted it since it won The Next Great Starship contest. I'm also super pumped for my Retaliator to be Hangar ready soon (second ship shown of the two in the following video).

Hmnh_EafsRE

It seems like every second or third time CIG releases a new ship, my wallet looks up and shouts "Save me!"... and I look down and whisper "No."
http://i.imgur.com/VaAFVEK.png

[Btcc22]

http://i.imgur.com/VaAFVEK.png

This makes me feel a little bit better about some of the poor financial decisions I've made in life. Really puts buying Tera but never playing it, only for it to go F2P within months, in perspective. :ohdear:

[Amit]

The FPS gameplay looks so fucking cool. I haven't seen helmets bump around and get washed out like that since Star Wars Republic Commando:



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjPknKFClCU

Those graphics omg. And the battle in the mess room reminded me so much of The Pillar of Autumn and then I though about how cool it would look if that level was recreated in the 4th gen CryEngine.

[InnerGoat]

http://i.imgur.com/VaAFVEK.png
freelance why you do this :(

[Amit]

Because he can.

[Cortexian]

freelance why you do this :(
because i am financially responsible

[Donut]

Well he's gotta do something with all that disposable income.

[Amit]

Well I suppose you'll be getting this, too, then?: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Standalone-Ships/Aegis-Retaliator-Anniversary

[Btcc22]

Well I suppose you'll be getting this, too, then?: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Standalone-Ships/Aegis-Retaliator-Anniversary

I bet keeping this game in perpetual development would be pretty lucrative!