America Won WWII You Bastards

[Emmzee]

From a forum I frequent:

Lately, I have been hearing a lot of noise from “across the pond” concerning WWII. Something about how the Americans were late to join, only provided back-up to troops already fighting, and took credit for a win that wasn’t theirs. Pretty much a bunch of blasphemous lies.

Now, I could use these paragraphs to prove my point with history and battle numbers, but that’s just not my style. Besides, that would be boring. Instead I am going to tell the story of one of the elder Zero’s; my grandfather to be exact.

This particular incarnation of zero was a farm kid. Like most guys back then he barely finished 8th grade and could give two shits less about the great war that was going on half a world away. His mind was preoccupied with finishing his chores so he could go out with his friends and get shitfaced. That is… until word came down the pipe that America needed guys to fight in Europe.

Like so many of his peers, he immediately signed up. There would be no pussy jobs for my granddad. He joined the infantry: a “grunt” is what they were called… good for fighting and dying and not much else. Politics made little difference to the old zero and his friends. All they knew is that help was needed and, for fucks sake, they were going to be that help.

He was 16 when him and his buddies joined up. They were kids. Within the next few years they would become men the likes of which aren’t seen on this earth anymore. They saved the world. Now, it seems, the world has forgotten.

It was France that made the difference. The Germans threw everything they had at a relatively small number of American troops. Due to the blizzard and the fact that our guys barely had shoes, if they were lucky, the Nazis must have thought they had us. However, elderly zero and his boys held them off. Within a few weeks the Nazis had fallen back while the Americans stood strong. It was like 300 but with a better ending.

The one thing that struck me about this group of guys is that they didn’t complain. When asked, my grandfather would always say, unapologetically, “We did what we were told to do.” Even in old age he never regretted his part. He even went as far to take a bullet for you, Europe. Granted, it was from his own gun as he was reloading during battle, but that still counts due to the fact that he shot many Nazis before finally leaving the fight to be treated.

Most guys like me have grandfathers like this. Americans who selflessly went to die for the sake of the rest of the world. Without our greatest generation, the world would have been ruled by Nazis. That is, if luck prevailed and the Russians didn’t win. Though I am sure London would look decent in a nice shade of red…

Regardless of what you think about America these days, do not take out your frustrations on a group of men who were truly heroes. I’m certainly not taking anything away from the brave men of the many other countries who fought and died during that foul, but justified, war… however they had to be there; our guys chose to be there. For that, we get the win.

You bastards.
I had a granddad like his. He was a rear gunner in a bomber, and was shot down in a raid over Germany. He survived for 4 days in hostile territory, without the use of his severely injured leg, until he was picked up.

Your thoughts?

[rossmum]

Fuck that, where were they during Stalingrad? Pretentious cock.

America helped win WWII. Anyone who thinks they played a larger part than Russia, Britain or even Australia needs a good, hard kick to the crotch. War vets should be respected, and that means not rating your own over anyone elses.

Edit:

Ask him about the 27.2 million Americans who died when the Germans inva- oh wait. That's right. America was sitting safe and happy and completely oblivious to the world while that happened. Meanwhile, the Russians were fighting tooth and nail with the Germans for everything they ever worked for.

[Emmzee]

Fuck that, where were they during Stalingrad? Pretentious cock.

America helped win WWII. Anyone who thinks they played a larger part than Russia, Britain or even Australia needs a good, hard kick to the crotch. War vets should be respected, and that means not rating your own over anyone elses.

Edit:

Ask him about the 27.2 million Americans who died when the Germans inva- oh wait. That's right. America was sitting safe and happy and completely oblivious to the world while that happened. Meanwhile, the Russians were fighting tooth and nail with the Germans for everything they ever worked for.
When I quoted you in a reply, here's what he responded with:

Oh yeah? We beat back the Germans from France, we nuked the Japs, and we gave Europe ammo for free. You're acting like the United States was to Europe what France was to the Colonies in the Revolutionary War. Well, we weren't. As for entering late, in case you didn't notice, we were in the middle of a Great Depression. Not to mention the political climate in the US was that of isolationism, and even then, as early as 1939, we were lend-leasing Britain and France immense amounts of ammo and weapons at our own expense. So stop bitching about how "America didn't help until Japan attacked us."He has a point.

[CN3089]

Anyone who thinks [America] played a larger part than Russia, Britain or even Australia needs a good, hard kick to the crotch.

Wait, I don't think I understand you correctly. You think Australia played a larger part in defeating the Axis than the USA? http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c251/CN3089/Emoticons/emot-psyduck.gif



And yes, America was instrumental in winning WWII. Perhaps the USSR could've beat the Nazis back to Germany without them, but they would still have most of Western Europe.

[Flyboy]

Look, Germany had most of Europe occupied, meaning most of the troops used by France and England (france specifically) were running low. America wasn't being attacked for quite a while, meaning it's army was fresh, and big, really really big. Also, the fact that the American home land wasn't being invaded meant that America had the ability to put all its out to help liberate other countries, rather than defending it's own. France was quickly invaded, and the UK was so close they still had to keep an eye on their home front.

Tell me, where would France be if the thousands of US troops hadn't come to liberate it?

Also, the fact that America could fight in the Pacific and the Atlantic was extremely useful (though I suppose Russia could too).

Russia and the USA were the biggest helps in the war. And though Hitler would fall to any one of these super powers eventually, without both of them working together the war would have lasted a lot longer with tens of thousands of more casualties.

[rossmum]

Wait, I don't think I understand you correctly. You think Australia played a larger part in defeating the Axis than the USA? http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c251/CN3089/Emoticons/emot-psyduck.gif
No, of course they didn't. But they did send a hell of a lot of soldiers to every theatre of the war - and served the Japanese their first land defeat with practically no support from anybody.

Trying to say any one nation won the war is stupid. The Allies won the war.

[Warsaw]

Because Australia was really as involved as the USA, Britain, Russia, and France...:downs: (granted they were in from day one, but a lot of their participation was focused in Africa and the D-Day invasion).

Let's face it: Churchill was desperate for our help, and it took awhile to convince Roosevelt to step in (and a Japanese attack to spur the motivation). France had already pretty much lost. Russia held its own, but needed relief on the other side, in order to pus west (Stalin was disgruntled by the fact that D-Day didn't happen sooner).

Of course no nation won the war single handedly, but the USA was the key to victory, just like in World War I.

[rossmum]

...Right.

Seriously, no. They were the key in the Pacific, but if it hadn't been for Britain's RAF, there wouldn't be a Europe to save, because without the UK there'd be no staging ground. They were one of the keys in late-war Europe - you guys seem to forget the British Paras were the first actually on the ground fighting, and doing a bloody good job of it - but they weren't the key.

...Mind you, I'm beginning to suspect American schools teach America was thekey to fucking everything, because I've heard it enough times.

[Warsaw]

No, schools here don't teach at all.

[rossmum]

:downs:

[Pooky]

Trying to say any one nation won the war is stupid. The Allies won the war.

.


If America had not joined the war the outcome might have been very different, but it makes as much sense to say that if America had been in the war from the beginning and the Russians joined late then the Russians were the key. Reinforcements were the key more than anything else.

[Zeph]

...Right.

Seriously, no. They were the key in the Pacific, but if it hadn't been for Britain's RAF, there wouldn't be a Europe to save, because without the UK there'd be no staging ground. They were one of the keys in late-war Europe - you guys seem to forget the British Paras were the first actually on the ground fighting, and doing a bloody good job of it - but they weren't the key.

...Mind you, I'm beginning to suspect American schools teach America was thekey to fucking everything, because I've heard it enough times.

American schools teach the economics and major engagements of the war (aerial, naval, and ground). I'm not going to say America won the war, as it was an allied effort, but logically and politically it's mainly so. Hitler's belief on the military constitution was a tragic mistake. If Germany developed its resources for just a few more years before beginning hostilities, they might have been able to hold off Russia. Germany, through use of occupation and weapons of terror, managed to put the rest of Europe into a position where they had to bring in arms and soldiers from a politically neutral nation. I call that a defeat. But of course, the phrase, "You might have won the battle, but you haven't won the war," comes to play.

I'm not sure how much history you've been schooled with, but pre-WWII and for a good bit afterwards, America was the center of the universe. That doesn't mean it's the only thing that's in the universe; many people believe so, however. I'm not saying that as a stuck up citizen, so dont bother trying to argue that.

edit: Woops, didn't edit something properly before I posted.

[Warsaw]

The world wouldn't have fallen into a depression when the US did if what you are saying wasn't true. That's proof enough right there.

[rossmum]

I know, like I said they were one of the keys. I don't think you guys give Britain and Russia enough credit though, few people do. It's generally assumed that without US support, Britain would be toast. Not quite. I've lived there, and let me tell you even as recent as 10 years ago the whole country just about would pull together like nothing you've ever seen before. The spirit they have there is fucking incredible, and even if the Germans had won the Battle of Britain and Seelowe had gone ahead, they would've had one hell of a fight on their hands. It's the same with the Russians... they lost 11.2 million soldiers (rough estimate; wouldn't surprise me if it was too low) during the war and over half of those were in the first two years. Including civilians, that's 27 million people... roughly half of all WWII deaths. They got smashed at first, but once the Germans got bogged down in the Caucasus and Stalingrad, they were screwed. Again, they just had such a drive to destroy the Germans it's not funny. I also doubt many of you have heard of the Ghurkas, the elite Commonwealth mountain troops from Nepal (if I remember correctly). The Allies had some amazing soldiers throughout the war, but it seems the only ones anybody gives a shit about these days are the Americans. Hardly anyone even knows about the Germans anymore... I bet if I said to that kid [who posted what Emmzee quoted] the Fallschirmjägern were better than the American paratroopers (which they honestly were, like most of the Wehrmacht - shame it got ruined fighting for a madman), he'd probably start spurting out all sorts of patriotic bullshit at me. Yes, America is and always has been pretty fucking powerful, but no, it's not the best country in the world. There is no 'best' country. People need to learn that.

[nooBBooze]

^ +rep :_)
The Propaganda on both sides surely is one of the most terrible facts about WWII and its aftermath. its kinda freaking scary it survived up to 2007.

[rossmum]

The real sad thing is that it's human nature to try and impose your country's greatness upon others. You ever seen the comments section of Soviet national anthem videos on youtube? Disgraceful. "AMERICA IS BEST" "NO RUSSIA IS BEST" "HEIL HITLER LOL" Personally, I think their anthem kicked everyone elses' asses :p

[Zeph]

The world wouldn't have fallen into a depression when the US did if what you are saying wasn't true. That's proof enough right there.
You couldn't be more wrong. If some spoiled princess brat thinks she's the center of the universe and runs out infront of a bus, that doesn't mean the rest of the world dies with her. And the rest of the world did suffer. Not nearly as much as America herself, but trade didn't stay strong.

[rossmum]

We got pretty badly screwed over, too.

[Zeph]

I don't think you guys give Britain and Russia enough credit though, few people do.
It really depends on your point of view. Hitler didn't give Russia enough credit.

[rossmum]

Hitler didn't give anyone enough credit. He failed in every way it is possible to fail military-wise and mentality-wise.

...and ruined what was, at the time, the best army on the planet. What a fucking waste.

[nooBBooze]

The real sad thing is that it's human nature to try and impose your country's greatness upon others. You ever seen the comments section of Soviet national anthem videos on youtube? Disgraceful. "AMERICA IS BEST" "NO RUSSIA IS BEST" "HEIL HITLER LOL" Personally, I think their anthem kicked everyone elses' asses :p
Link pleeees :D


You couldn't be more wrong. If some spoiled princess brat thinks she's the center of the universe and runs out infront of a bus, that doesn't mean the rest of the world dies with her. And the rest of the world did suffer. Not nearly as much as America herself, but trade didn't stay strong.
Some of the bigger europe buisnesses are having a tough time with some "real estate crisis" in the Us. The gov even pumped around 100 billions into the Stock markets. its not like i entirely grasp this whole, evil, capitalist machine but nonetheless, i get 1,3 $ for 1 € and therefore a 33,3%
discount on everything in the US wich is :woot:.

i think the bottomline is, from the economical point of view, the world is pretty much united since an event in one part of the world can cause a reaction in an other part. And especially events in the US tend to be able to cause major reactions all over the world since most economys rely on the US for some reason :/

[rossmum]

wpKRd2xQeq8

comments @ http://youtube.com/watch?v=wpKRd2xQeq8&mode=related&search=

Trying to persuade a Russian friend to sing it on our last assembly, but he doesn't know the old lyrics :gonk:

Edit:

LtU3vUOa2sw
English recording. Interestingly it says it was recorded in 1943; it didn't become the national anthem until 1944.

[nooBBooze]

Hitler didn't give anyone enough credit. He failed in every way it is possible to fail military-wise and mentality-wise.
Would have been better if he only became the artist he wished to become.
We would have a more or less capable painter now instead of well... a very naughty and dead man.

[rossmum]

Yeah, though I doubt he was 'all there' to begin with.

[nooBBooze]

Meh theres a lot of art around wich deserves the comment "Wtf lol even i could do that. Id just put some explosives in some paint cans/draw random lines with my pencil/dump some garbage on a glued plate and thats it. 1000 bucks pls." its all about rep - if ppl say your a deep person you can realy label whatever you want as "art" and ppl will start interpreting it and add "meaning" to it even if you nail ur used toilet paper on a wall.
Then again it were different times back then.

Okay where were we? oh yes.. America won WWII you bastards!
Hmm...didnt know panama, columbia argentinia, mexico, venezuela and their friends were involved in it. Wow learnign never stops :V

[rossmum]

Yeah, pretty much about the art. Sometimes I wonder if people read too deep into it and if the artist really did just want to see what it looked like when they threw tins of paint at the canvas :p

Also, www.hymn.ru/index-en.html (http://www.hymn.ru/index-en.html)

woo woo

http://folk.ntnu.no/makarov/temporary_url_20060919zkkfg/anthem-sovietunion-1977-bolshoith.mp3 - the 1977 Bolshoi Theatre version, my favourite one.

[Zeph]

Some of the bigger europe buisnesses are having a tough time with some "real estate crisis" in the Us. The gov even pumped around 100 billions into the Stock markets. its not like i entirely grasp this whole, evil, capitalist machine but nonetheless, i get 1,3 $ for 1 € and therefore a 33,3%
discount on everything in the US wich is .

What a childish view. You might be able to earn money on currency exchange rates over time, but you're just wrong. Especially thinking you can get a discount on American things. I know this isn't a universal example, but dont you remember how much more the 360/PS3 was in Europe than America?

[nooBBooze]

Things like electronics and transatlantic flights really seem to have a stable price. I saved a lot on Hotels and shopping tough on a base of similar prices of course.

[Bodzilla]

No, of course they didn't. But they did send a hell of a lot of soldiers to every theatre of the war - and served the Japanese their first land defeat with practically no support from anybody.

Trying to say any one nation won the war is stupid. The Allies won the war.
i serioulsy love u dude.


it seems u bastards have forgotten the massive impact australia had on the 2 world wars, and the way our Allys treated us....
Gallipoli comes to mind..... england took us for granted, and the single greatest reason imo that we needed help from america is because australia as a country has never been geared as a war machine with mass production of tanks, chopers and battle ships.
but when it came to the on-ground fighting and dedication it's pretty hard to beat what the australians managed to do.
think gallipoli, the kokoda trail, the rats of tebrook.... and all of it was taken for granted.

and just for the record australias economic depression was just as bad or worse then america.


edited out profanitys :\

[Agamemnon]

Seriously, what the hell is everyone's problem? It's shit like this after over 60 years the war has been fought that there's still a rift between people and countries. No wonder every country hates each other and most countries would have no problem taking the simple road of "hate America."

A lot of countries played their part. Some played bigger ones. Whether it was because of an economic or a social crisis, not every country could contribute as much as others did. But what, all of the sudden they don't exist?

And what about those countries? What exactly are you crying about when you already know that your country's past put its effort into it? When it comes down to it, history textbooks don't say, "Well, if it weren't for the Americans, everyone would be speaking German now." And since if people ever really want to learn they'll read an unbiased source, then what are you worried about? You act like as if you don't have blind, ignorant, and propagandistic-fed people in your country as well.

All I can really say about why who wasn't where when they "should've been" is that a lot of World War II was politics for each country. We don't give General Patton much credit, but the sonofabitch could've ended the war sooner if there weren't such high political tensions between each nation and "who would get the fair share of victory." I only know too well of the stories of Patton too; my grandfather served in his outfit, was his personal radio operator, and was his frequent driver as well.

So seriously, why are we bitching over who did what and who didn't do what? Even after sixty years how do we know all of the true details for sure? Give it a rest, I say. It's not like arguing over the Internet about it is going to make it change.

[rossmum]

^ What he said. Also,

MY DADDY COULD BEAT YOUR DADDY

Edit:

Zilla, you forgot Long Tan... proving ground for the SAS and the rubber plantation where our fellas lost 19 and took 500+ NVA and VC out of about 2-3,000 with them in zero vis, heavy rain, at night, with our own shells coming in 25m in front and not a single friendly fire casualty :awesome:

[FlyingStone]

Correct me if i am wrong, but wouldn't it just be easier to say that everyone who was involved in WWII played a crucial role in defeating the Axis?
Or am i getting the wrong impression?
Don't kill me D:

-F.S

[Emmzee]

Correct me if i am wrong, but wouldn't it just be easier to say that everyone who was involved in WWII played a crucial role in defeating the Axis?
Or am i getting the wrong impression?
Don't kill me D:

-F.S
I'm pretty sure France didn't play that critical of a role, what with being occupied by Germany in 1940.

[Limited]

The war was won in England, by the English. Thanks to our superior defences.

If USA didnt help, would we be fucked and Germany won? Probably, If Austrialia didnt help, would we have lost? Probably, if Russia hadnt helped would we have lost? Probably.

I dont give a shit which country in the war won the most. Its the fact that germany lost that counts.

I commend ANYONE no matter what nationality who helped fight the nazi's, it was a joint effort by the world.

[FlyingStone]

^Agreed IMO.
-F.S

[Con]

Oh yeah? We beat back the Germans from France, we nuked the JapsWhat the fuck? That wasn't fighting, it was genocide. 144 000 innocent civilians killed. Feel proud fucker.

[Archon23]

I love how its "the Japs" and not just "Japan"

[Agamemnon]

People were dying nonetheless, Con. People were still putting bullets through people's heads; the decision of those that were in charge was to make war seem so costly that they would back out, as the mentality of the Japanese military command at that time was that they would fight until the last man. The U.S. did the same thing for Dresden as well. The Germans did it for Britain. Hell, every country attacked the other's morale, and the problem was that each one only saw it as lowering morale instead of the world's population.

But let me stop there, lest I go on about how killing people is wrong and then have people jump down my throat how we justify it as doing.

[Con]

There's a difference between killing soldiers in a war, and mass murdering civilians. That can never be justified.

[Agamemnon]

Soldiers are civilians. Many were soldiers not even by choice. Even more believed different propaganda.

[Limited]

People were dying nonetheless, Con. People were still putting bullets through people's heads; the decision of those that were in charge was to make war seem so costly that they would back out, as the mentality of the Japanese military command at that time was that they would fight until the last man. The U.S. did the same thing for Dresden as well. The Germans did it for Britain. Hell, every country attacked the other's morale, and the problem was that each one only saw it as lowering morale instead of the world's population.

But let me stop there, lest I go on about how killing people is wrong and then have people jump down my throat how we justify it as doing.My granddad was shot down over japan on the 4th day of the operation, the japanese caught him, put him into cage and tortured him every day for rest of the whole war. He survived, however it was very weak and his organs were never the same again, he died later in life when I was younger due to organ failure which I believe is directly because of the torture.

Although I feel so much hatred to those Japanese solders that did it. Those innocent Japanese people had no right to be bombed like they were.

One of Americas worst and darkest hours of its military action.

[TeeKup]

No amount of tears, words, or money can ever make up for what the United States did to Hiroshima and Nagasaki. People are still suffering to this day because of the radiation effects. What the U.S. did was unprecedented, unacceptable.


Soldiers are civilians.

I'm sorry but you are wrong. A soldier is someone who voluntarily forfeit's his morality to serve others. Once a soldier experiences war he is no longer human. He is expendable, he is worthless in the eyes of his government no matter what his government says. Killing a soldier in war can be seen as the equivalent to killing a bug on a side walk. Killing a civilian in war for the sake of winning said war can be compared to killing a man in front of you just because he's taking his time.

Nothing can and or will justify the act of genocide on the civilians of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

[rossmum]

Nor the foul and downright inhumane massacre of thousands of Chinese, British, Australian and American prisoners as well as entire Chinese villages by the Japanese Unit 731 in order to test antrax and bubonic plague as weapons to later be used on western US cities. Several areas are still infested by the black plague to this day.

...Everyone fucked up somehow or other.

[Agamemnon]

Who the hell keeps saying that I'm trying to justify the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

And seriously, what are you people, hypocrits? You first say killing masses of people can't be justified, but then you say it's hunky dory if you kill a soldier? I don't give a damn what governments classify soldiers and civilians as, especially when many countries drafted their soldiers (there was a lot of free will involved there). Those "soldiers" were sons to fathers who would outlive them. A son should bury his father, not the other way around. And what about the soldiers who had wives and children? But no, they are soldiers. They are worthless. They're not civilians at all.

[TeeKup]

Nor the foul and downright inhumane massacre of thousands of Chinese, British, Australian and American prisoners as well as entire Chinese villages by the Japanese Unit 731 in order to test antrax and bubonic plague as weapons to later be used on western US cities. Several areas are still infested by the black plague to this day.

...Everyone fucked up somehow or other.

Don't get me wrong. What the Japanese Empire did to the chinese was unthinkable as well, I simply spoke out for the innocent victims of the Nuclear attacks. No one should have to suffer that fate.


Who the hell keeps saying that I'm trying to justify the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

And seriously, what are you people, hypocrits? You first say killing masses of people can't be justified, but then you say it's hunky dory if you kill a soldier? I don't give a damn what governments classify soldiers and civilians as, especially when many countries drafted their soldiers (there was a lot of free will involved there). Those "soldiers" were sons to fathers who would outlive them. A son should bury his father, not the other way around. And what about the soldiers who had wives and children? But no, they are soldiers. They are worthless. They're not civilians at all.

You're speaking as if it's a perfect world where things such as war, death, famine, etc do not exsist. Weither you realise it or not, until the machines alone take over the battlefield, the soldier must take the role of the expendable drone. Yes a soldier may have family and that family will be sad when he is gone, but he accepted that responsibility and possibility when he joined the military. Weeping for those who have accepted their fate is meaningless, nothing shall come from it.

[rossmum]

Yeah, I know. Nobody deserves war, full stop... except the assholes who cause it.

In response to Aga's post: what he said. Killing soldiers is no better, regardless of whether they volunteered or were conscripted.

[Emmzee]

Nothing can and or will justify the act of genocide on the civilians of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
Nor the Bataan Death March. Nor the Holocaust. Nor the firebombing of Dresden. Nor the slaughtering of Chinese villagers by the Japanese. Nor the use of kamikazes. Nor the deals France and America made behind Vietnam's back near the end of the war.

Looks like you left some stuff out.

[Limited]

Teekup just summed it up perfectly.

I dont like killing in any way really. Unless its terrorists ,but thats a separate subject.

Yes soldiers are people too, however they know they could die fighting. There will never ever be no wars, people just wont get on perfectly, sadly thats the harsh reality.

[Agamemnon]

You're speaking as if it's a perfect world where things such as war, death, famine, etc do not exsist. Weither you realise it or not, until the machines alone take over the battlefield, the soldier must take the role of the expendable drone. Yes a soldier may have family and that family will be sad when he is gone, but he accepted that responsibility and possibility when he joined the military. Weeping for those who have accepted their fate is meaningless, nothing shall come from it.
It's a mentality like that that we still have wars. People find peace such a hard concept to believe because it's never happened. As different generations come and go, we learn nothing from our past and continue to repeat it, and thus we have fooled ourselves to believe peace is unreachable and inevitable because it's never been experienced before. Continuing to think that it is impossible will make it even less probable of a chance to happen, especially as the shit escalates higher in today's world. After all, it is being surrounded by death and corruption and greed that we are no longer bothered by it. People turn on the news everyday to hear about death that they eventually stop watching the news because they believe it's nothing new. And that's just it. We become more heartless, we come less in tune with others and their feelings, that we become disconnected from feelings and set out boundaries, our set of morals, and our standard of living based upon the actions around us and how one perceives it.

I don't know about you, but I am a realist, and as a realist, I understand the real possibility of there actually being peace. What billions don't want to come to term with is that doing so will take such a mountainous effort that it becomes unappealing, and as the decades go by, the challenge becomes more and more appalling, as we continue to dump the trash in the same spot over and over.


Yes soldiers are people too, however they know they could die fighting. There will never ever be no wars, people just wont get on perfectly, sadly thats the harsh reality.
Check out above.

[TeeKup]

You and I are 2 different people then. Thus this argument can go all over the world and back and we probably won't reach an agreement. However you described our generation lacking in morality. Please don't think of me myself that way. I simply stated the simple truth of today's world when in reality I can't stand to see the sight of death. Even the sight of blood sends a chill down my spine. So I hope you don't see me or everyone else on these forums as cold and heartless as you said in your post. :eng101:

However you need not worry. Humanity WILL change, that my good Agamemnon is inevitable. It's just going to take several centuries before we evolve to that point.

[Agamemnon]

No, I don't, I was just speaking out in general. And I know too that we won't agree on the situation, so let's just stop here. I respect your views and I'm sure you do the same for me, so that's enough for me.

[rossmum]

There was once a completely peaceful civilisation in South America, one of the first known to have existed, way before the Inca. They disappeared just about overnight due to - from what I remember - a few pricks who wanted all the power and had turned others to their cause.

Greed and intolerance of the unfamiliar are part of human nature, a very nasty part at that. Few people actually have the will, let alone the strength, to resist them.

[TeeKup]

No, I don't, I was just speaking out in general. And I know too that we won't agree on the situation, so let's just stop here. I respect your views and I'm sure you do the same for me, so that's enough for me.

I respect your views as well. (I've gained some rather nice insight from this debate.)

That being lets move on. :)

[Cortexian]

America didn't win the war, the allies did.

What the fuck is wrong with you Americans taking credit for which you did not do? I'm sure the "Americans" would have made a slight dent in the war if they tried to do it by them selfs, without any other allied nations helping, they wouldn't have won though.

Plus America is the most incompetent country in the world, this is fact.

[TeeKup]

America didn't win the war, the allies did.

What the fuck is wrong with you Americans taking credit for which you did not do? I'm sure the "Americans" would have made a slight dent in the war if they tried to do it by them selfs, without any other allied nations helping, they wouldn't have won though.

Plus America is the most incompetent country in the world, this is fact.

While I'm not exactly in disagreement with what you said, I do suggest you watch your tongue lancer.

[FlyingStone]

Plus America is the most incompetent country in the world, this is fact.
...
Wow, right.
-F.S

[Apoc4lypse]

jesus christ, why the hell is this always argued over, especialy between the allies.

Point is the Allies won, if they didnt who knows what today would be like, I dont want to know.

Sure you might be able to say that one country did more than another but thats not the point of it all, our grandfathers and relatives didnt fight in order to have one country claiming they did more than another one. The point is when the time came we ALL stood together to defeat evil, and that is what all of us should be proud of.

Really whats the point in argueing, it kind of degrades what they did back then for us all today.

[Cortexian]

While I'm not exactly in disagreement with what you said, I do suggest you watch your tongue lancer.
Or what, like I said, fact.

[Roostervier]

You think any other country could have made large dents fighting the war by themselves either? You just said the Allies won. Last I checked, America was one of the Allies. So, in turn, we helped. Also, sounds to me like you aren't aware of the fact that there are ignorant people, and they are not limited to living in America. Just because they say something doesn't mean they are talking for America. The fact that you are treating it so makes me think you are one of those ignorant people I just spoke of. Also, discrimination much? Grow up.

[Limited]

America didn't win the war, the allies did.

What the fuck is wrong with you Americans taking credit for which you did not do? I'm sure the "Americans" would have made a slight dent in the war if they tried to do it by them selfs, without any other allied nations helping, they wouldn't have won though.

Plus America is the most incompetent country in the world, this is fact.Americans pre probably the most patriotic

[Limited]

America didn't win the war, the allies did.

What the fuck is wrong with you Americans taking credit for which you did not do? I'm sure the "Americans" would have made a slight dent in the war if they tried to do it by them selfs, without any other allied nations helping, they wouldn't have won though.

Plus America is the most incompetent country in the world, this is fact.Americans are probably the most patriotic people in the world. Some of them thing America is the centre of the world. Its good to be patriotic, I'm very patriotic but Americans can be very cocky, thinking their the biggest, the best and the winner.

And this isnt just my personal view, this is how many many british people see Americans, I'm not knocking you, I love Americans :)

[Apoc4lypse]

i my self am an american and I agree, many americans are like this, but that doesnt mean we all are... not to mention I can come up with more stereotypes about other countries too not just us... :eyesroll: doesnt mean anything thats just what they are stereo types.

I'm patriotic though dont worry, I just dont go around voicing were the best all the time, and I dont think we are either...

I however am very interested in our countries history, and WW1 and WW2 are my favorite chapters in this history, not because I think were amazing, but because I am proud that my country was a part of somthing big like the allies, I'm proud to be living in a country that when the time came we stepped up to the plate, this is how everyone should feel about there country and WW1 & 2.

I'd just like to see one of these discussions where every one isnt out there mouthing off left and right about what country is ignorant, or who did the most etc etc...

[Bastinka]

:words:..I'm very patriotic but Southerners can be very cocky, thinking their the biggest, the best and the winner.
FTFY.
Anyway, I'm german and luckily my grandma lived in latvia *A piece of the old big Poland* and not germany when it got bombed by the Allies.

[Emmzee]

Americans are probably the most patriotic people in the world. Some of them thing America is the centre of the world. Its good to be patriotic, I'm very patriotic but Americans can be very cocky, thinking their the biggest, the best and the winner.

And this isnt just my personal view, this is how many many british people see Americans, I'm not knocking you, I love Americans :)
We're cocky because America is the center of the world. We are the best. We always win.

But you wouldn't know that, being a limey and all.

[TeeKup]

Or what

You'll get warned like you so obviously just did.

[Emmzee]

I'm very patriotic but Americans can be very cocky, thinking their the biggest, the best and the winner.
Because you've lived in America your whole life, so you've experienced this...oh wait.

[Agamemnon]

Because you've lived in America your whole life, so you've experienced this...oh wait.
No, it's clear that he's met every single American to make that accusation and has met everyone else in the world in every other country as well. I mean, I've met like four British people and I can say that, as a fact, they're egotistical, ignorant, and constantly fool themselves that their language stopped changing after the French raped it.

But remember, this is a fact. Can't argue it after I've claimed it as a fact, so there's no point in trying to counter it. Yep. /sarcasm

And here I thought we were done with the bickering in this thread.

[Limited]

Because you've lived in America your whole life, so you've experienced this...oh wait.Read what words I put please. Same with you Agamemnon.


Americans can be very cocky, thinking their the biggest, the best and the winner.
Can, meaning not all the time and not everyone of them.

You dont have to live in America to know things about America, I hope you guys realise, just because you guys might be blind about the ways other countries work doesnt mean the rest of the world are. Oh and I'm judging this from test scores.

[Agamemnon]

Hey 9mm, you're forgetting the one where I wasn't born and raised in America. :awesome:

Care to generalize some more on your "can" argument?

[Limited]

I've said enough for you to understand? Can being its possible to be it.

[Zeph]

This doesn't seem to be going anywhere else on topic.